I'll try to keep this a brief as possible, but from late 90s to the early 2010s the formula was to start a backpack rapper and go pop by dumbing your s*** down for mass consumption. You had to "prove" that you were really down with hip hop and that you could really rap well

See Big 3, Lupe, Wale, Sean, Tyler etc. (Of course there are exceptions to the rule).

S*** really if you stretch it to the 90s there are other countless examples.

Nas -- Q-Tip famously thought If I Ruled The World (Imagine That) would ruin Nas' career because of its poppier feel

2Pac -- 2Pacalypse Now -- Strictly 4 My N.I.G.G.A.Z

Now I feel as though that the formula since the mid 2010s until now has been the reverse. (Music and the consumption of it has also changed a lot).

Rappers now start off adopting popular melodic trends or s*** that leads to a surefire success commercially, and then transition to material where they can show "they can be taken seriously".

21 savage ----specifically I am > I was

Yachty --- his current run

Lil Baby -- At least for the bigger picture

Gunna -- A gift and a Curse

(Again there are exceptions to the rule)

There are probably other examples and once again just an observation

op actually made a valid point

Great point tbh. "I'm really rapping on this one guys" right after their novelty wears off is always in the playbook.

The formula has been creating quality projects that gain you a loyal fanbase

Which is why there hasn’t been anybody lately come up. Younger listeners don’t listen to entire projects and artists aren’t good enough to carry them.

To add on to this, I think the guys you listed got in the game because they just wanted to make money/get famous whereas the early guys wanted to make money but also had love for the art form equally.

Yachty even confirmed this in the interview with Cole saying that he had to go back to study hip hop music in order to get better. I do think the younger stars want to just be famous and this is the best way to do it for them

ultimately, I think the love for the art form with the newer guys isn’t 100% there. I think this is what Tyler was even trying to say in the Nardwuar interview.

Eh....I see what you mean but I think this is a bit of a stretch.

Even though IWW had catchier songs than Illmatic, Nas was actually a very strong technical rapper on IWW, arguably stronger than on Illmatic.

Even "If I Ruled The World" has strong rhymes and an entire 3 verses. Hell, the only thing "pop" about the song was the Lauryn Hill hook.

Pac was also a more technical lyricist on 7 Day Theory than any of his pre-DR albums(And it beats any of his pre-DR albums besides MATW).

Very interesting point. The reverse almost sums up what makes Hip Hop such a refreshing genre and culture: it's competitive spirit

Jack Harlow
Doja Cat

So basically Lil Wayne's pre Prime run

Side note- why is drake going at joe budden? I thought Joe was a self-admitted fan.

A part of Joe's review of FATD triggered Drake.

And Drake snapped at him on social media and even had his father attack Joe. And things got a bit messy.

But yeah...it's ironic because Joe gives Drake more props than many other rappers today. They've been reconciled.

I'll try to keep this a brief as possible,

This is a good thing

Ktt we got some work to do

Yeah this is not a good look, comes off a bit insecure. Thanks for that bc I posted this in the wrong thread on some high s*** 🤞

I just bumped the Remedy a couple days ago

your theory makes sense when Cordova disowned his song with Boosie to make Penthouse Gucci Shoes

Atlantic was really doing their damndest to put this potential theory to the test with having Lupe and B.o.b on the radio at the same time.

Not saying it isn't but I would like to know why you think that

I mean "pop" hip hop songs from the 90s are very different than "pop"hip hop songs today. I don't disagree with Nas following up Illmatic strongly with IWW. I knew using him and Pac would be tricky given their extensive catalogues (and in Pac's case he improved greatly from the start of his career until his passing).

Yes