Elric

5y

Leo was great and there are few good scenes but overall terrible and pointless

Elric

5y

I liked their relationship but one of the most off-putting cheers I ever sat through at the cinema was when Brad's character absolutely liquified those poor brainwashed teenage girls. Brad, who was shown to already be a wife killer and tough enough to easily whoop Bruce Lee like can y'all simmer down the stakes were not that high here and this man is enjoying this way too much for someone on acid

Elric

5y

What does that mean exactly wise 1

internet buddy

5y

There’s a theory that the flamethrower was a reference to the Vietnam war but I only heard about it in passing

Fella

5y

My line in the sand is when you start arguing what someone enjoys implies something negative about them.

Aruji

5y

The entire film is derailed by detours of cinematic violence with the hero figure, Rick Dalton, being glorfied for his efficient viciousness (albeit in a campy manner). Cliff, on the other hand, represents a more realistic presentation of that sort of hero but still a stylized version more akin to the New Hollywood films of the 70s. A sympathetic stoic underdog who is also racist, a murderer and so on (far more serious than Rick Dalton). The stereotypical male hero of that time. Then the film ends with "Once Upon A Time in Hollywood" being written all over the screen while the scene is still running and therefore implying that it's a film aka the same medium as the detours. It's imo both a fairy tale of how Sharon could've been saved but also an indictment of the broader structural and systemic issues of violence and to some degree even patriarchal dimensions (Sharon is basically a naive girlish maid/damsel) that were prevalent in Hollywood that time and actually to this day (see #metoo). I wouldn't really say that the message is actually opting for the way Sharon has been saved but rather a way of how we could've imagined it knowing that we've all been influenced by that kind of media (a major theme in the film. That's also why the Manson kids explicitly mention it before entering Rick's house).

Fella

5y

I disagree with this reading of the film too but it’s at least more respectable than Elric’s

internet buddy

5y

I thought the Bruce Lee scene was an exaggeration in his mind

Elric

5y

If it was an exaggeration in his mind then why did Kurt Russell and DiCaprio have that debate about whether he was a murderer in his trailer before he whooped Bruce Lee's ass

Elric

5y

Because tex has a big swinging d*** could've tossed little Charlie in front of a bus if he wanted

My thoughts on this are definitely just a result of accumulative effect of watching QT be gross my whole life. Like I said Polanski and Hitchcock and a lot of other guys I consider goat have made equally heinous moves so it's not like I'm going to stop watching his movies or hold it against him forever.

SegaDreamFlash

5y

"he wrote very passionately about guys like Kenji Mizoguchi, Fassbinder, Cukor, Libitsch, Ozu etc and their feminist films and things like that"

can you namedrop some of these movies, need some for research 👀

Aruji

5y

what's your reading?

Oscar Winner

5y

Lol you gotta stop treating women like they’re helpless poor creatures bro.

DELETE BACKLAVA

5y

THIS MID DROPPED YET @Elric

Elric

5y

Man I've trained Jiu Jitsu with some badass chicks for years and years I know they're not defenseless but in the power structure of Hollywood it's just gross sometimes

Elric

5y

NOÉ (no-way)

Oscar Winner

5y

Bro really think this will be mid 🤦🏽‍♂️

Fella

5y

I dont have a particular strong reading of it. As I’ve said many times, I’m not interested in what art has to say but HOW it says it. I resonate with the way it presents people and places and the moods they conjure up. The way the sounds compliment the imagery. The general aesthetic and feel. Zoning in on interesting people as they move between spaces and enjoy the summer air. I just disagree that Tarantino is attempting to make some broad indictment of any systemic horrors. The reading that the film is actually reactionary I also disagree with. It’s somewhere in the middle. Tarantino is equally fond of these things as he is critical. I don’t believe he shares the views the Manson family expresses in the car before entering the house. I believe he’s making a mockery of the absurdity of their position and using it as a weapon against them. Interviews after the films release seem to confirm this. He hasn’t changed his stance from that famous Kill Bill focused clash between him and a concerned soccer mom.

Aruji

5y

i care more about films how do things too. However, it's about the reading now.

So yeah, I wouldn't say Tarantino makes clear cut moves in any direction either but I'm mostly pointing out that it's actually way more morally ambiguous than usual. I wouldn't say he speaks in a deterministic way (after all, he made Django Unchained) but definitely acknowledges the influence of media.

Also, I wouldn't say that Tarantino doesn't acknowledge systemic topics. Pulp Fiction can be interpreted as the circulation of money. He's more of a libertarian (not particularly heavy right or left-leaning although I'd say def more left-leaning) for sure but I don't think he ignores it. More than half of his films have very strong emancipatory undertones.

Oscar Winner

5y

Bro really think this will be mid 🤦🏽‍♂️