Every single civilization in history has fell because they didn’t evolve. Not surface level changes but foundational
America is not immune to this

I just don’t get why there shouldn’t be a UBI that provides housing, food, water etc to people

Basically just human rights

Everyone gets the same base level. It’s not gonna be perfect but it’s adequate healthy food, housing and education

Then you can have a market where people can buy better housing or better food or whatever

I just don’t think essential goods should be commodified

businessinsider.com.au/germany-begins-universal-basic-income-trial-three-years-2020-8?r=US&IR=T

Then wtf

That being said I’m a personal believer in these funds being assigned

As in they have to be used for housing or food Or whatever

If you own a house already you don’t get the housing money

And basic healthy food and s*** shouldn’t be taxed

we don't live in the past. simply because capitalism might have helped us in some ways (although i still find it unacceptable regardless of the time) doesn't mean it will continue to serve us in the same way.

We have achieved industrialisation, in fact we have over achieved it. It's not really realistic to expect the change from the non- industrialized world to occur again. In fact, to keep upsizing is holding us back technologically i.e homes are still built far behind technology as to meet the capitalistic demands

we can do more with less effort but that is not a profit increasing model so capitalism doesn't allow for it. Remember that poverty is by and large a statistic that is governed by capitalism, both poor and rich are created as part of capitalism and are not calculated on the ammount of real recources. Also remember that the competition demand supply graph is by and large psuedo science created to promote deregulation around the industrial revolution and is shown to not hold true in macro economics but particualry as evidenced by disaster scenarios

hope this wasnt to confusing lol

I mean automation would be good without capitalism. But yeah I see your point.

What?

Well you're wrong

The first part of your argument I do find interesting, although I was responding to the idea that capitalism has never been successful. I do see that it can seem toxic especially in recent years, but I do believe it is generally positive and can continue to push humanity to breakthroughs in science and technology that make everyone’s lives better. I don’t think it should be without some sort of regulation though, I know it’s not perfect. But I think we can find a balance between decreasing the wealth gap and getting rid of capitalism entirely, which quite honestly makes everyone’s lives better more than people on here seem to think.
Do you have any sources for the claim that “supply and demand is pseudoscience” cause that’s a bold claim I really don’t see backed up by the real world (or any established sources)

easy i pick Socialism

u talking about people losing the desire to work, thats cute.

Capitalism makes me lose the desire to live

You're assuming that under socialism you would somehow suddenly have a desire to live

how much of ones life do they devote to only pleasing their employer under capitalism and have to put up with it for fear of losing income that pays for rent, the ransom the job has on their healthcare, and otherwise

Well if it didn't what incentive would anyone have to do any work, which everyone needs for society to function.

I have a hard time believing anyone would do anything productive or difficult for society (of which there are many things) with no incentive. There are things nobody wants to do that have to get done, and only get done because people are rewarded for it. That's just life. There's really no easy solution that'll fix everybody's problems and make everyone happy

How about we live in a construct where niggas get their money up not they funny up ya heard

what incentives are there under capitalism that you're arguing for?

Not getting evicted? Literally we're having worldwide protests this year (even with a pandemic) over the issue of police who defend private property over human lives because once again, money is more important than the well being of humanity in capitalism,

maybe im not connecting to exactly what you're looking for, i apologize, this is just the way i see it

can't get ya money up when u getting evicted in a pandemic after being laid off

Oh murica

yeah, as far as worldwide, thats a lil bit different convo

I do get that sometimes it can feel like money is more important than human lives under capitalism. I just feel like as a whole I don't see a working alternative that wouldn't be worse for everyone on average, personally. I do see where you're coming from though. I think that having something like UBI or some other solution that prevents those who are low on money for whatever reason (like a random f***ing pandemic taking jobs away) from basically making it hard to live at all. I know a lot of Americans are struggling so I do think we do need to try something

I live near SF and it really hurts me seeing so many homeless people and how other people treat them like they're not even human (although this is a much more complex problem that could be a whole different conversation). I feel like people don't even care. It just reminds me how drastic the differences can be from those who have s*** and those who may have gotten unlucky. I guess I'm just saying I see where you're coming from

Except it hasn’t failed in those countries. The US has spent the last century orchestrating coups in Latin America there is literally no way you can argue against this...

I'm down to have a more thought out convo when I'm not drunk

way I see it right now is,

I live in the US, where I can see some of the greatest flaws of capitalism, which is imperialism cloaked in the word "democracy" in my opinion,

I'm down with people having their own business and being able to sustain themselves,

but some people are benefiting off labor too much (trillions of $) for people not to have healthcare facilities they can go to without going into heavy debt,

and i may be redundant but I see socialism at large, as the process to fix the problems that occurred under capitalism, imperialism,

and we can talk about the past and authoritarian extreme governments or whatever but,