Banana Clip

1y

Insane operation

YANDHI

12mo

I coincidentally attended a speech by Ukraine's ambassador to the U.S. the day after the operation and witnessed the euphoria everyone had about this close up. But in the week since you can kinda tell little came from the operation, and that the damage was likely overstated. That's the issue with Ukraine post-2022. It has tactics and grand schemes, but no strategy for the actual ground war. Only distractions

"Ukraine’s Drone Attack Doesn’t Matter": https://foreignpolicy.com/2025/06/09/ukraine-drone-attack-spiders-web-doesnt-matter/?tpcc=recirc_latest062921

However, the understandable satisfaction that many observers felt upon learning of Spiderweb also reflects some of the errors that have undermined efforts to develop an effective response to the Russian invasion. Brilliant tactical innovations cannot make up for asymmetries in forces or resolve and the absence of an effective overall strategy. Three years into the war, Kyiv and its backers still lack a convincing plan to thwart Russian President Vladimir Putin’s war aims and convince him to end the fighting. Putin’s resolve does not appear to have been shaken by this latest incident, and he was true to his word when he told U.S. President Donald Trump that his country was determined to retaliate.

--

Seen in this light, the recent Ukrainian drone operation—as impressive as it was from a purely tactical standpoint—was essentially a sideshow. In this sense, it is not unlike Ukraine’s equally unexpected and initially successful incursion near Kursk, which also failed to alter the course of the war and has since been completely reversed. Destroying a dozen or more strategic bombers won’t really affect Russia’s ability to continue advancing in Ukraine or to launch additional missile and drone attacks against Ukrainian cities.

WRU

12mo

its clear to anyone who thinks about it for even a second: whats the point of deep adventurist operations when you lose ground daily in whats supposedly a defensive war. its all flash for more foreign support to make sure some kind of backing keeps coming in

WRU

1y

@sab pull the plug big bro. op is dead, no significant updates or news on the whole thing, no meaningful discussion for the last however many pages. might as well create a new peace talk thread later when those actually happen

WRU

12mo

for libtards sanity do it

Vert1600

12mo

Request a perma too tired of your crying itt

Banana Clip

12mo

“Supposedly a defensive war” nice dog whistle Russian fed.

“Brilliant tactical innovations” is literally the entire game plan when fighting asymmetric warfare against a far larger and stronger state. If Afghanistan and Iraq had bordered the US they would’ve made so many attacks inland.

Ukraine doesn’t (and can’t) win conventionally everywhere, it just needs to impose costs on Russia disproportionate to the effort involved. Furthermore, disrupting the Russian war machine at its source (airfields, fuel depots, other sabotage efforts) directly reduces pressure on the front because it forces Russia to divert resources, spread out defenses, and rethink logistics. It also psychologically forces Russia to acknowledge their own territory is not safe, consequences to their aggression.

International support is critical but Ukraine doesn’t carry out these operations just for optics. The core objective is battlefield advantage, to make it harder for Russia to continue its invasion, stretch their capabilities thin, and create strategic dilemmas for Russian commanders.

YANDHI

12mo

I agree on the notion that a smaller power has to impose costs that make the effort unsustainable, but i think where I (and the professor I quoted) disagree is that these operations actually do that.

Ukraine's successes have usually come from launching attacks that trigger retreats from Ukrainian territory. Kherson is a good example. Those are the hard hitting moves that are needed and I don't think attacking fuel depots every now and then, drones to strategic bombers or even taurus strikes equal that at all. They do it because its all they have left. Same with Kursk. That only ended up stretching Ukraine thinner and then it got entirely reversed with thousands of more men lost

If all we get this summer is Ukraine doing sabotage missions as Russia's offensive picks up territory every week then what are we left with? You're supposed to be using tactical attacks to add to the pain, not as your only weapon.

The operation allowed drones to partially level the playing field as air support, but it doesn't actually alter Russian thinking nor can serve as a strategy. The fact U.S. basically helped clear the path for Russia's retaliation itself tells you enough.

YANDHI

12mo

I agree on the notion that a smaller power has to impose costs that make the effort unsustainable, but i think where I (and the professor I quoted) disagree is that these operations actually do that.

Ukraine's successes have usually come from launching attacks that trigger retreats from Ukrainian territory. Kherson is a good example. Those are the hard hitting moves that are needed and I don't think attacking fuel depots every now and then, drones to strategic bombers or even taurus strikes equal that at all. They do it because its all they have left. Same with Kursk. That only ended up stretching Ukraine thinner and then it got entirely reversed with thousands of more men lost

If all we get this summer is Ukraine doing sabotage missions as Russia's offensive picks up territory every week then what are we left with? You're supposed to be using tactical attacks to add to the pain, not as your only weapon.

The operation allowed drones to partially level the playing field as air support, but it doesn't actually alter Russian thinking nor can serve as a strategy. The fact U.S. basically helped clear the path for Russia's retaliation itself tells you enough.

PFLP optimisticman

12mo

Ukraine should become direct allies with isreal so russia can bomb the s*** out of them

OnceAgain

12mo

Weirdo

OnceAgain

12mo

Weirdo

snowboyrari

12mo

no I want as many countries as possible to bomb israel. russia ofc won't go to war with israel for a lot of reasons but I don't discourage such things.

snowboyrari

12mo

no I want as many countries as possible to bomb israel. russia ofc won't go to war with israel for a lot of reasons but I don't discourage such things.

WRU

12mo

@YANDHI can u recreate the thread and keep it updated? thatd be super sweet

JaeRell

12mo

Bro tryna delete a classic thread.. smh.