americana

4y

I don’t think your skillset is what determines your class. It is how your skillset is employed in a wider system where power is determined by ownership and subjugation to ownership

Peasants can be bourgeois, just as much as those who handle financial capital (handle, not own). Finance workers can (very rarely) be proletariat just as much as the poorest serf. Brokers working long hours and handling multiple phones a la Wolf of Wall Street

It’s about what you own and what owns you, not what you do to get into one of those positions

(This is an textually unprincipled position, just off my head)

deadacc

4y

i would understand in the case of for instance cuba, but a massive part of the privatization of healthcare is the monopolization of access to medical knowledge and practice as well as the accreditations.

i mean i made the comparison of trucker owner operators as petty bourgeois, but i also am not entirely certain that is a correct classification

SEGA GOON

4y

Thread is way faster and more active than on KTT1 and not filled with Bernie bros We did the math once and it was twice as fast as the ktt1 thread

SEGA GOON

4y

There are plenty of jobs with restrictions. Engineers, architects, lawyers, teachers, doctors, accountants, auditors...

deadacc

4y

· edited

i think americana wrote what i was trying to get across. is that also along the lines of what you understand?

also i heard the example of mcdonalds vs in n out as monopoly vs non monopoly capitalist. does that example make sense ?

also are the monopoly capitalists solely individuals or structures as well? or is there a better way to understand them

RoosterShooter

4y

crazy how slow this thread is Tbh. 5-4 years ago this would have been the premiere ideology to compete with capitalism

deadacc

4y

interesting thank you

and i assume you also understand doctors, lawyers, and professors to be petty bourgeois ?

Scratchin Mamba

4y

Thread is more active than it used to be tbh

We don't have as many dumb arguments itt anymore bc kkktt all got banned so it's mostly just socialists itt discussing things itt

Which i like better tbh, much higher quality discussion and it's not like we all agree on everything either

Scratchin Mamba

4y

Thread is more active than it used to be tbh

We don't have as many dumb arguments itt anymore bc kkktt all got banned so it's mostly just socialists itt discussing things itt

Which i like better tbh, much higher quality discussion and it's not like we all agree on everything either

Scratchin Mamba

4y

I would say they're labor aristocracy

But more often than not they've made so much money that they start investing it as capital that they eventually do become petit bourgeois

americana

4y

They gave EVERYONE a second chance it’s crazy how many more people get banned these days

RoosterShooter

4y

nice turn of phrase. lol no sarcasm.

i was an avid user on the og site and didnt venture into the politic section. i regret that tbh. i was a tv/film andy.

but from what other users have said, mass bans. controlled moderation. ostracization. and now its sort of peaceful.

thats nice tbh.

so do ppl still believe in a socialist ideology or a method in which there would be a healthy or consistent implementation of said policies of socialism?? dont have time to scroll thru the entire thread but

it seems like more ppl are moving away from this ideology.

Scratchin Mamba

4y

I think there's a distinction to be made in class status vs revolutionary potential.

Undoubtedly, the revolutionary potential of doctors earning 300k a year is a lot less than those of construction workers or even teachers, and yes that's also mostly based on their material interests. But does that make them not proletarians? I wouldn't say so. People who claim that the lumpen proletariat aren't revolutionary don't say they're not proletarians anymore, I think we can apply the same principle to high earning wage laborers

That's just my take tho @deadac

Scratchin Mamba

4y

I also don't in any way see how students would be petit bourgeois, if anything students have been some of the most revolutionary throughout history. Like Haile Selassie setting up universities backfired on him because those students eventually overthrew him in a revolution

RoosterShooter

4y

sounds like u were there for the big transition. il take ur word for it that ppl got second chances to be cool about certain topics. tho i have no evidence to support it.

how long have u been a part of this board

deadacc

4y

definitely the crucial aspect to this is revolutionary potential, and people from all classifications have revolutionary potential depending on specific circumstances - probably except for the monopoly capitalists.

with that in mind its a semi pedantic point to scrutinize but i think its just one of those specifics that goes inherently unspecified that i randomly realized my understanding was not complete on.

Scratchin Mamba

4y

I would say they're labor aristocracy

But more often than not they've made so much money that they start investing it as capital that they eventually do become petit bourgeois

Scratchin Mamba

4y

Yeah i used to be in gd sxn a lot, it was wild lol it was basically just the racism sxn ngl

I would say if anything people have become more disillusioned with the prospects of capitalism being reformed, a very big chunk of bernie bros have become full on communists since

Scratchin Mamba

4y

I feel you, but it's not an unimportant topic at all tbh

A lot of the bs coming from leftists who say all workers in the first world is bourgeois basically comes down to the fact that currently their revolutionary potential isn't so high

deadacc

4y

ig the real question i have is if there is some fundamental mistake in classifying petty bourgeois as something overdetermined rather than a more rigid classification in their relation to the means of production

americana

4y

I’ve been here since 2016 lol

RoosterShooter

4y

what aspects of captialism did they want to be reformed??

sounds like the bernie bros (like other ppl have said) never intended to hold their ground or gather ppl to their side. as soon as he didnt preform, they lost their juice