Jan 21, 2023·1 reply
ASAKIUnfortunately not too uncommon
It happens more then people think. Even if not that way of working too hard. Ive heard multiple stories of people working so much they get divorces, die early, and the sad ones when they retire and within a few days.
More firms should have the option of only doing 40 hours max a week even if means pay cut.
- OPJan 21, 2023·1 replyDedication 666
It happens more then people think. Even if not that way of working too hard. Ive heard multiple stories of people working so much they get divorces, die early, and the sad ones when they retire and within a few days.
More firms should have the option of only doing 40 hours max a week even if means pay cut.
Unfortunately higher revenue PA firms aren't going to do that-- just because it damages their bottom line. Even when they're hemorrhaging talented personnel because they pay peanuts for entry-level and senior positions like now-- they'll never enforce a limited work week for busy season.
It's a significant consequence of the profit motive
Jan 21, 2023·edited·2 repliesASAKIWell yes but IB is a stepping stone immediately to CorpDev/VC/PE/etc. which makes absolute boat loads of money. A senior associate in PE at minimum is making $250K, for example.
IB is the equivalent of PA where it's not necessarily good by itself (although IB actually makes decent money unlike PA) but it will pay a lot of dividends down the line. When you break it down hourly, they actually get paid very little with the hours they put in
That being said I agree with you and I would never give up my WLB, even with the "prestige" that comes with high finance. Which is also why I entirely skipped PA and went straight to industry. Give me 6 figures in MCOL with FP&A in a year or two and I'm good lol
It’s a good path if all you want to do is make money but imo when you compare it to consulting/tech it gets to a threshold of comp for most people where the money is more than good enough in other areas with better hours/work
You got tech workers in their late 20s making 350k regularly on 40 hours a weekand they actually get to invest their money unlike bankers (working in financial services restricts from you from investing/owning equities and other securities)
PE is still a pretty grindy and dull life tbh
I’d probably be most attracted to working at a hedge fund where you’d still pull a lot but would be doing much more interesting work
Also if you’re interested corporate development you can get that exist opp out of FP&A or consulting as well
- OPJan 21, 2023Birdie
It’s a good path if all you want to do is make money but imo when you compare it to consulting/tech it gets to a threshold of comp for most people where the money is more than good enough in other areas with better hours/work
You got tech workers in their late 20s making 350k regularly on 40 hours a weekand they actually get to invest their money unlike bankers (working in financial services restricts from you from investing/owning equities and other securities)
PE is still a pretty grindy and dull life tbh
I’d probably be most attracted to working at a hedge fund where you’d still pull a lot but would be doing much more interesting work
Also if you’re interested corporate development you can get that exist opp out of FP&A or consulting as well
Tbf comparing anything to tech short of Director/Corp. Controller/Partner/CFO is gonna be depressing lol
Like I said, not for me, but for the crazies that just wanna make a s***ton of money without any life to spend it on, they can go ahead
Funds/quant shops unfortunately need a really strong math/CS background or a very prestigious school with great connections or going through the IB/ER grind. Otherwise I agree-- looks like pretty interesting work depending on where you land
That's the plan. Hoping to land a Senior FP&A position by next year, then network a s***ton to get into my company's CorpDev/M&A teams. Otherwise I'll guess I'll just climb the ladder till I find something new to do. Maybe Treasury or IR
- Jan 21, 2023ASAKI
Unfortunately higher revenue PA firms aren't going to do that-- just because it damages their bottom line. Even when they're hemorrhaging talented personnel because they pay peanuts for entry-level and senior positions like now-- they'll never enforce a limited work week for busy season.
It's a significant consequence of the profit motive
I've seen smaller firms do that as a way to attract top talent but yea there's no reason for bigger firms to really do that.
- Jan 21, 2023·2 repliesBirdie
It’s a good path if all you want to do is make money but imo when you compare it to consulting/tech it gets to a threshold of comp for most people where the money is more than good enough in other areas with better hours/work
You got tech workers in their late 20s making 350k regularly on 40 hours a weekand they actually get to invest their money unlike bankers (working in financial services restricts from you from investing/owning equities and other securities)
PE is still a pretty grindy and dull life tbh
I’d probably be most attracted to working at a hedge fund where you’d still pull a lot but would be doing much more interesting work
Also if you’re interested corporate development you can get that exist opp out of FP&A or consulting as well
Tech can make 350k in late 20s!? is this only like google, microsoft, apple in California?
- OPJan 21, 2023·2 repliesDedication 666
Tech can make 350k in late 20s!? is this only like google, microsoft, apple in California?
FAANG/MANGA and living in VHCOL areas (NYC, Bay Area, etc.)
It is possible to reach that salary otherwise in 10 YOE+ from what I've heard, especially if you're good at Leetcode. @designing can shed more light maybe
Jan 21, 2023·1 replyDedication 666Tech can make 350k in late 20s!? is this only like google, microsoft, apple in California?
anecdotally, when i was at my internship there was a dude who was 29 making 240k after 10 years of experience.
- Jan 21, 2023·1 replyASAKI
FAANG/MANGA and living in VHCOL areas (NYC, Bay Area, etc.)
It is possible to reach that salary otherwise in 10 YOE+ from what I've heard, especially if you're good at Leetcode. @designing can shed more light maybe
Damn. is that just the best people or is that normal for most?
- Jan 21, 2023·1 replybitch mob
anecdotally, when i was at my internship there was a dude who was 29 making 240k after 10 years of experience.
240k after 10 years seems doable. Are you counting internships or did he not have a college degree or advanced degree?
- OPJan 21, 2023·1 replyDedication 666
Damn. is that just the best people or is that normal for most?
Pretty exclusive. I'd equate it to getting into IB/PE in terms of difficulty. However, working a SWE job at FAANG is way, way better than working in high finance, at least in terms of QoL and WLB.
Jan 21, 2023·2 repliesBig 4 audit and losing my mind
Jan 21, 2023·1 replyNinaChopperBig 4 audit and losing my mind
What’s big 4 mean
- Jan 21, 2023Dedication 666
240k after 10 years seems doable. Are you counting internships or did he not have a college degree or advanced degree?
military and college degree.
- Jan 21, 2023ganger
What’s big 4 mean
ey, kpmg, pwc, deloitte
- OPJan 21, 2023·1 replyNinaChopper
Big 4 audit and losing my mind
How long have you been there
- Jan 23, 2023·2 repliesASAKI
How long have you been there
6 months. going to get out after a year.
- Jan 23, 2023NinaChopper
6 months. going to get out after a year.
why? you should at least stay till senior
- OPJan 23, 2023·1 replyNinaChopper
6 months. going to get out after a year.
If you can stick it out, waiting until you get promoted to senior would be best. But definitely understandable if you call it quits by then.
Jan 23, 2023ASAKIFAANG/MANGA and living in VHCOL areas (NYC, Bay Area, etc.)
It is possible to reach that salary otherwise in 10 YOE+ from what I've heard, especially if you're good at Leetcode. @designing can shed more light maybe
Yeah, any FAANGMULA (Uber, Lyft, Airbnb, Databricks, etc.) will pay top dollar for talent. I know people making 220k+ with about 4 YOE at the moment.
levels.fyi has visibility on people's total compensation (TC). I should note that $220k isn't just base salary. It's usually something like $120k as your base salary with the rest coming from Restricted Stock Units (RSUs) over vesting.
- Jan 23, 2023·editedASAKI
Pretty exclusive. I'd equate it to getting into IB/PE in terms of difficulty. However, working a SWE job at FAANG is way, way better than working in high finance, at least in terms of QoL and WLB.
@dedication Yeah, it's exclusive, but it's easier to break into with enough Leetcode and System Design prep than in something like the Quant/Hedge Fund space.
As @Asaki said, the WLB and benefits are very worthwhile compared to other industries
- Jan 25, 2023·2 repliesASAKI
If you can stick it out, waiting until you get promoted to senior would be best. But definitely understandable if you call it quits by then.
Yeah, I think sticking till senior would be better, but I find the work too boring to motivate me. I work in IT Audit, which I guess has a reputation for being boring, and it’s not really my intended career path at all. I graduated with a degree in Management Info Systems last year and honestly looking for something a little more technical and not accounting/audit related. I know the exit ops are pretty good with B4 but I don’t think this career path is what I’m looking for. I mostly took the role because it was the first thing that came to me after graduating. Mostly just planning to stay the year so I won’t have to give back the signing bonus. Mostly chill job but busy season hours right now are frustrating. Maybe it’s because I’m almost entirely remote too, but hardly any interactions with other coworkers here, my teams are basically just me and a manager.
- OPJan 25, 2023·3 repliesNinaChopper
Yeah, I think sticking till senior would be better, but I find the work too boring to motivate me. I work in IT Audit, which I guess has a reputation for being boring, and it’s not really my intended career path at all. I graduated with a degree in Management Info Systems last year and honestly looking for something a little more technical and not accounting/audit related. I know the exit ops are pretty good with B4 but I don’t think this career path is what I’m looking for. I mostly took the role because it was the first thing that came to me after graduating. Mostly just planning to stay the year so I won’t have to give back the signing bonus. Mostly chill job but busy season hours right now are frustrating. Maybe it’s because I’m almost entirely remote too, but hardly any interactions with other coworkers here, my teams are basically just me and a manager.
Why do MIS majors always land in IT Audit man you guys have such a good degree!!!!!!!!
So, IT Audit can be a difficult field to get out of in terms of exit opportunities, but you have some options:
1. Try to transfer to another division in your firm. Network with other departments' managers and you can land yourself in a place you actually like, even in PA. I know a friend who rotated from IT Audit (despised it) into Data A***ytics (loved it) and went on to do a career in it. I believe B4 has tech consulting/advisory but those can be difficult to land.
2. Exit into industry into compliance-related roles. There are easy opportunities here, but they will be similar to what you're doing now. That's InfoSec, GRC, and normal Internal Audit. However, I'm going to argue that these three are way better than IT Audit by itself. Get your CISA, CPA would be great as well. Down the line you can get the CISSP once you have enough experience and you'll immediately gain a ton of prestige in InfoSec.
3. Network and put your best foot forward to pivot into Corporate Finance. This will be a numbers game but having Big 4 on your resume is a big boon. This is only going to be an option if you stay until senior and complete the CPA.
4. Just do IT Audit in industry. This can range from being interesting (operational IT Audit) to being the same boring s*** in PA (endless controls testing) but you'll actually be paid a good salary and have WLB.
Again, all of these (except for maybe #1) will be much easier if you hit Senior first, but it's doable otherwise. @wes I think you can maybe correct me on any of these points or tell me I'm a f***ing dumbass/give some advice
Jan 25, 2023·1 replyASAKIWhy do MIS majors always land in IT Audit man you guys have such a good degree!!!!!!!!
So, IT Audit can be a difficult field to get out of in terms of exit opportunities, but you have some options:
1. Try to transfer to another division in your firm. Network with other departments' managers and you can land yourself in a place you actually like, even in PA. I know a friend who rotated from IT Audit (despised it) into Data A***ytics (loved it) and went on to do a career in it. I believe B4 has tech consulting/advisory but those can be difficult to land.
2. Exit into industry into compliance-related roles. There are easy opportunities here, but they will be similar to what you're doing now. That's InfoSec, GRC, and normal Internal Audit. However, I'm going to argue that these three are way better than IT Audit by itself. Get your CISA, CPA would be great as well. Down the line you can get the CISSP once you have enough experience and you'll immediately gain a ton of prestige in InfoSec.
3. Network and put your best foot forward to pivot into Corporate Finance. This will be a numbers game but having Big 4 on your resume is a big boon. This is only going to be an option if you stay until senior and complete the CPA.
4. Just do IT Audit in industry. This can range from being interesting (operational IT Audit) to being the same boring s*** in PA (endless controls testing) but you'll actually be paid a good salary and have WLB.
Again, all of these (except for maybe #1) will be much easier if you hit Senior first, but it's doable otherwise. @wes I think you can maybe correct me on any of these points or tell me I'm a f***ing dumbass/give some advice
dumbass 😂😂😂
- OPJan 25, 2023wes
dumbass 😂😂😂
