.....but we still expect the OG's and established acts who debuted 10-30 years ago to dominate like they're still at their peaks.

Like I've seen some people on my TL swearing that Cole's album flopped, had no impact, and came and went.

Yet Cole's album still outsold and outstreamed 90% of rappers who debuted after him not named Don Toliver.

ADL, Casino, It's Been Awful, Slime Cry, Early Life Crisis, Emotions, etc. sold and streamed far less than TFO yet they don't get anywhere near as much niggas laughing at them for supposedly being "flops" that "came and went."

It's like a classic case of "Is it Oochie Wally or One Mic?" Even f***ing Habibti which is a throwaway R&B album outsold most of these new niggas and people call it a flop. Don't Be Dumb and Bully get called that too even if the metrics say otherwise. Outside of Octane(in which case, Don ain't even a new nigga lol), these newer rappers ain't held to the same standard of dominating.

And I see people "predicting" that a Jay album would "flop" too.

It's weird because, 20 years ago, it was the other way around. Niggas wasn't expecting LL Cool J or Ice Cube to dominate over TI, 50, Ye, Wayne, and Jeezy lol.

Slime Cry didn't flop leave YB outta this.. it's currently outcharting The Fall Off despite being released earlier.. you right about those others though

Hip hop is ever evolving. It’s still a very young genre. What we thought was the norm I.e. superstar rappers dominating for about 5-10 years and then being replaced by the new guard is no longer happening that way. Drake, Kendrick and Cole are 15 years in and are still some of the most relevant voices in hip hop right now. We haven’t seen this before and we most definitely don’t know what will happen next.

We always said hip hop was a young man’s genre but I think that’s changing too. Older rappers (40+) are and WILL be just as normal as a 20 year old rapper. A lot is changing and quite frankly it’s really interesting to witness.

I was watching a youtuber and he mentioned albums aren't the main method of delivering music anymore like they were pre-streaming, so new artists aren't crafting albums the same way they used to

Didn’t YB just have a whole movie in theaters?

it's cus ppl attention spans are fried this how they listen to albums these days

Yeah, Michael was based on YB's life.

Nigga arguing whos in the charts 18 weeks later

Not a rap issue imo

Yea that Cole album trash s*** really did come and go LMAOOO

Because everytime you bring up that most aspiring new niggas can’t fundamentally rap you get called an old hating ass nigga for thinking the future of rap doesn’t involve cosplay of Keef Thug Future Carti from 5-10 years ago. The average corner nigga from like a nappy braids Meek Mill freestyle type video (who were tryna take after Cassidy Beans Free Fab etc) were so much better than the average aspiring rapper today who just spams simple ass post Thug and Migos esque punchlines “i ball like (NBA player)” “i ___ like (overdone movie or cartoon reference)” rap is a hustle and just another aspect of people’s brand now

Wayne into thug future keef carti is the turning point. Niggas have no reason to care like that now

For some reason this site don’t let you make long posts and still see the Post button so continued:

The people who could be game changers like Ghais Guevara or any of the niggas who y’all gonna quote the above post with counterexamples don’t currently have a mainstream rap infrastructure that values having a message, individualism at the expense of short term hits, or dense lyricism

And the other niggas who are vaguely lyrical and mainstream ready relative to their era and sound like Lil Tony, samara cyn or Nino Paid just seem to hit a ceiling because there’s no trajectory of what a new Big 3 type rapper would even do given everything is so fragmented.

This is another thing

If anyone takes artistic risk or doesn’t try to make 15 “bangers” you got these talentless f***s faking and exxagerating reactions for content

This entire s*** needs a reboot and its gonna take an artist with the right combo of swag, connections/backing, understanding of knowing what to do and not to do in the 2020’s rap climate, a lack of s***crimes/sex pest behavior and other cancellable offenses, a mind that thinks above street s***/scenarios/“opps” and s*** (stay out of jail), and hits but all of that + a pure love for rap to want to fix it

Man could have been pop smoke rip

we didn't know that the 2004-2013 era and everyone that either peaked or debuted during that time would be the last guard for hip-hop. everyone laughed at the "real hip-hop" perspective last decade and look what happened... all the acts that were promoted to the forefront and said to be this "new era of hip-hop" lacked the source of high quality fundamentals it takes to actually sustain for 30 years

Tyla
Pink pantheress
Sabrina carpenter
Chappelle Roan
Olivia rodrigo

Who are the rap equibblents (positioned as the next big stars in the genre not the exact artist archetype) that debuted after 2020

It absolutely is a rap problem lol

there is a sheer mismatch in artistic/cultural and label/industrial interests regarding rap music that prevent artists from touching mainstream like you’re trying to imply

You especially can’t compare it to mainstream pop music because thats simply label-generated music pushed into the algorithm. There isn’t an underlying cultural backing, just an entirely commercial one

Compare it to rock, rather

Is it that or do most new rap artists debuted after 2020 no longer try to not make widespread appeal music that also has lyrical meat and potatoes like Graduation, Thank Me Later, Carter 1-3, Blueprint, GRODT, etc? Those type of artists incentivize label interest and support

Hence the question of who would those equivalents be without even getting into the label’s backing

Labels bottom line would love another Kendrick or Drake with 10/15/20 years ahead of them: hence the polarization around someone like Doechii seeming to have the industry backing you say labels aren’t incentivized to give rap that some fans feel she’s undeserving of

(continued)

Of course the label not finna give a nigga who primarily makes one dimensional autotune & distortion music or insular street drama music 8 figure deals lol

Who debuted after 2020 is worth giving $20-30 Million of resources to? Based off the trajectory and heights of Drake, Kendrick, Kanye, Em, 50, Wayne, Outkast, etc as the relative expected ceiling? Nett f***in spend? Lmao

Even people like Travis, Gunna, Don Tolliver who are certified hitmakers wouldn’t recoup that because they can’t really fundamentally rap outside of making catchy cool songs (*i think Gunna could be that type of artist though, he understands mainstream rap brand building/saying slick s***)

Niggas clown lyricism like thats not what fueled the mainstream 1994-2015 lol. That’s it, outside of monoculture dying in general (which Sabrina Carpenter, pinkpantheress, olivia rodrigo, tyla, chappelle roan, etc have to also compete with and are doing pretty good) that’s the root of the problem.

Pink pantheress wasnt made in some label lab but she fundamentally understands how to give her genre/demographic meat and potatoes s*** that sticks to her fans bones even in her eccentricity. Most mainstream adjacent rappers just make 15 cool songs with no deeper themes or connectivity

Most of the pop artists you named also have a personality/image/narrative surrounding them that they have carefully cultivated over time to endear them to their fans. 2010s rappers did that too.

You have to sell the world on your story and image as well as specific tracks. A lot of new school rappers are pretty faceless and don’t have much unique to say for the most part. There’s not much reason to come back outside of a song or two, so the albums are non-starters.

People only want one person to dominate. It’s dead if they’re not.

Wait until I drop

What a sad reality

You can see who is blowing up or is being stagnant by looking at the venues they are performing at. I thought Lil Tecca was very popular amongst the casuals but he still isn’t doing arenas.