·1 replyA rapper is way more of a performer then an artist at this point, being in front of a camera is more important then being in front of a mic at this point. That's why the genre isn't progressing, all beats are similar and up and coming don't care about actual rapping.
·1 reply
Roryrubberz (which AI aside isnt even a hip hop songI) blowing up over the hip hop music fenix flexin has made for a decade is not a good thing
The lyrics and the song are blowing up because he is a rapper and it is hip-hop inspired and it clearly effects the terrain of Rap.
People like the song because its fun. Because rap is fun. And it charted.
And to say it's not a good thing and not say HOW it is not a good thing is pretty interesting..I don't see anybody hurt by that song or a drastic change in creation from others that can be deemed as "damaging" to rap as a whole or his career *that was revived by the song)
- ·7 replies
rapsWho is the next Kanye Drake Jay Wayne Kendrick or even Cole or TI tier star lol
If you grew up in the 2000’s you know what I mean. Original, versatile, can rap on trendy s*** or foundational s***, and doesn’t primarily rely on melody
If you read the initial message, I said that it's pretty hard to get there when Rap Media/The Industry/The Internet are in shambles. It takes longer now..and some of the people that were getting really close died in towards the end of the last decade..that was a BIG setback. Pop Smoke, X, Juice Wrld, Lil Peep. They wouldve been critical pieces in how rap wouldve have matured in alternative spaces.
Kanye Drake Jay etc..all were able to benefit from those things (media, radio, tv exsposure, authority at the record labels) with a way more concentrated market.
We are in different times. It takes longer. It takes built in communities that are mature and understand and champion rap.
So when people s*** on the underground rappers it makes no sense. They are the ones that will be on those stages and have the best chances of being huge. (Ken Carson, Nine Vicious, Destroy Lonely, Che, etc)
People just want them to be/look like traditional rap artists. That is dead.
and then it's like..Lil Baby, Playboi Carti, NBA YoungBoy, and Lil Uzi exist...do these artists just mean nothing? are these not huge names produced in the last decade?
Do we seriously think there wont be more stars in rap? lol
threetwentysixVLONE-core music becoming a main direction for younger generations back in 2017-2018 was a mistake
Led to big amount of wannabe playboi carti's with no longevity whatsoever and influx of hypebeast fans who care more about vibes, aesthetic and fashion bs instead of actual rapping ability
yea i agree wit this sentiment now
- ·1 replylonny860
The lyrics and the song are blowing up because he is a rapper and it is hip-hop inspired and it clearly effects the terrain of Rap.
People like the song because its fun. Because rap is fun. And it charted.
And to say it's not a good thing and not say HOW it is not a good thing is pretty interesting..I don't see anybody hurt by that song or a drastic change in creation from others that can be deemed as "damaging" to rap as a whole or his career *that was revived by the song)
its bad because its ai and it blowing up gives labels and artists the greenlight to be lazy and put out more low effort ai slop, taking money and opportunities away from real artists
"its just fun" is part of how we got here in the first place
I think what makes a rapper great is the grind they had to put in to be successful.
90s/00s early 10s you were normally from a poor background, had to sell your CD on the street and perform anywhere you can to get some sort of traction.
Now you can see what the trend is, copy it and do a wild video on YouTube or Twitter or TikTok and watch it blow up.
Also different states had different styles because you didn’t hear a lot of other sounds back in the day. Now everyone knows what everyone is doing.
Diversity is at an all time low and I don’t really see how that is reversed.
- Rory
its bad because its ai and it blowing up gives labels and artists the greenlight to be lazy and put out more low effort ai slop, taking money and opportunities away from real artists
"its just fun" is part of how we got here in the first place
Yeah, I mean I do agree with that take. More so on the part where maybe it clogs the lanes for others that are more deserving.
I also think like swagger like us of forever who current rappers could even do a song like that?
I think when you see the big guys from the past finally retire you will notice a huge difference.
You had mac miller, odd future, asap mob, big Sean, wale, childish gambino, chief keef, B.O.B, early Migos all releasing around the same time was vastly different styles, sounds and personalities.
If anyone could give me a similar list of upcomers who hit all three I’d be amazed.
- lonny860
If you read the initial message, I said that it's pretty hard to get there when Rap Media/The Industry/The Internet are in shambles. It takes longer now..and some of the people that were getting really close died in towards the end of the last decade..that was a BIG setback. Pop Smoke, X, Juice Wrld, Lil Peep. They wouldve been critical pieces in how rap wouldve have matured in alternative spaces.
Kanye Drake Jay etc..all were able to benefit from those things (media, radio, tv exsposure, authority at the record labels) with a way more concentrated market.
We are in different times. It takes longer. It takes built in communities that are mature and understand and champion rap.
So when people s*** on the underground rappers it makes no sense. They are the ones that will be on those stages and have the best chances of being huge. (Ken Carson, Nine Vicious, Destroy Lonely, Che, etc)
People just want them to be/look like traditional rap artists. That is dead.
and then it's like..Lil Baby, Playboi Carti, NBA YoungBoy, and Lil Uzi exist...do these artists just mean nothing? are these not huge names produced in the last decade?
Do we seriously think there wont be more stars in rap? lol
Them passing away I do agree left a huge impact. Lil Peep I don’t think would’ve hit huge heights but I think he would’ve been successful.
Pop smoke and juice world would’ve been huge.
And the best thing about them three is how different they are.
- ·editedlonny860
If you read the initial message, I said that it's pretty hard to get there when Rap Media/The Industry/The Internet are in shambles. It takes longer now..and some of the people that were getting really close died in towards the end of the last decade..that was a BIG setback. Pop Smoke, X, Juice Wrld, Lil Peep. They wouldve been critical pieces in how rap wouldve have matured in alternative spaces.
Kanye Drake Jay etc..all were able to benefit from those things (media, radio, tv exsposure, authority at the record labels) with a way more concentrated market.
We are in different times. It takes longer. It takes built in communities that are mature and understand and champion rap.
So when people s*** on the underground rappers it makes no sense. They are the ones that will be on those stages and have the best chances of being huge. (Ken Carson, Nine Vicious, Destroy Lonely, Che, etc)
People just want them to be/look like traditional rap artists. That is dead.
and then it's like..Lil Baby, Playboi Carti, NBA YoungBoy, and Lil Uzi exist...do these artists just mean nothing? are these not huge names produced in the last decade?
Do we seriously think there wont be more stars in rap? lol
Nobody you named fundamentally can densely lyrically rap and they all rely on melody which makes it not really rap music. Its great for what it is but those are not Wayne Kanye Drake Kendrick Jay or even Ross TI Cole level rappers who primarily lyrically rap and aren’t substituting lyricism for aesthetics and melody. Hence actual rap (not even lyrical miracle s***, but albums like Graduation Teflon Don Thank Me Later Carter 3 Blueprint etc.) is dead in favor of whatever you wanna call the post rap autotune melodic s***
Why does everyone dance around this (niggas arent actually rapping its moreso autotune music that plays off of their visual/sonic aesthetic/beat selection) in this convo? Lol the artists you named have been here and we still have these convos because they arent fundamentally rappers on most of their songs & thats what the convo craving - lonny860
If you read the initial message, I said that it's pretty hard to get there when Rap Media/The Industry/The Internet are in shambles. It takes longer now..and some of the people that were getting really close died in towards the end of the last decade..that was a BIG setback. Pop Smoke, X, Juice Wrld, Lil Peep. They wouldve been critical pieces in how rap wouldve have matured in alternative spaces.
Kanye Drake Jay etc..all were able to benefit from those things (media, radio, tv exsposure, authority at the record labels) with a way more concentrated market.
We are in different times. It takes longer. It takes built in communities that are mature and understand and champion rap.
So when people s*** on the underground rappers it makes no sense. They are the ones that will be on those stages and have the best chances of being huge. (Ken Carson, Nine Vicious, Destroy Lonely, Che, etc)
People just want them to be/look like traditional rap artists. That is dead.
and then it's like..Lil Baby, Playboi Carti, NBA YoungBoy, and Lil Uzi exist...do these artists just mean nothing? are these not huge names produced in the last decade?
Do we seriously think there wont be more stars in rap? lol
Also RIP to all but
Lil peep is kind of a sneak in this convo
Juice WRLD could rap better than Uzi but fundamentally he would have been another similar melodic dude not really rapping about much although he definitely would have had a run
X was the next Drake level versatile artist forsure
Pop Smoke could have gone either way. 2020 is a long time ago so its easy to think he wouldnt have gotten into making generic drill too/ppl did him like they did lil baby just tired of his sound after loving it for years
They weren’t the last interesting or good rap artists on earth tho for that to still be the excuse 6 years later. Rip to them tho 
·1 replyrapsIn the mainstream {or whatever you want to call the type of s*** that makes it to Kurrco and Akademiks consistently/the post mainstream}
dense linear lyricism that continues a thought for more than a bar or two without the majority of the vocals being melodic is absolutely dying and the fact that niggas about to argue with me that rap doesnt have to be that, means rap is already dead. GGs
You know what irks me about this? How more melodic niggas don't just also have thought provoking lyrics or at least some level of wit too. It seems like most people are either one or the other. I think that combination is what could have saved this s*** a bit in the mainstream imo.
- ·1 replyAlbert Grindstein
You know what irks me about this? How more melodic niggas don't just also have thought provoking lyrics or at least some level of wit too. It seems like most people are either one or the other. I think that combination is what could have saved this s*** a bit in the mainstream imo.
Facts
Its like its mutually exclusive to them that melody means they have to also impulsively come up with random lyrics they dont think much about after getting super high and its like bro thats been tired as s*** for at least like 8 years. Using the cop out of “rap aint the same no more” to justify lower effort
Phil Collins or John Lennon had thought provoking lyrics at times and was melodic lol. Niggas scared to take a stance or have an opinion on anything in their songwriting they just want to be characters and preserve their brand
Three Meows MórEvery generation thinks this, don’t worry
I think about this a lot, and I think it's because the purpose of music changes and so people shift the way they create to that. It's just that how music is purposed now because of algorithmic systems is so f***ed that we have the order of things as they are today. Quality aside, the way music is consumed by the average listener in current times is not healthy for anyone long term.
BonelessWingsEvery time we say this s*** is dead a new era spawns.
Back during the ringtone era Nas was on that Hip Hop is dead s*** and the blog era came into full effect.
I seen Yeat and Carti perform in Romania and 100k people knew songs word for word.
Its not dead its just not as visible as it used to be and that is all due to lack of backing by labels.
Hip Hop labels are dying.
I mean yeah cause a lot of it is reactionary. People say it's dead and then people go to prove it wrong. That's why these conversations are ok to have.
Andre JaquetThis is a v measured take ur real
I want yall to rly grasp something here for the commercial aspect
Geese only has 1.5 million monthly listeners
Black county new road has 740kDenzel curry has 7.3m
These are the biggest new rock acts, a majority of rock’s streams is catalogue
Charli xcx has been in the game since 2008,
Taylor since like 06,
Beyoncé since the 90s
Ariana since 2012
FKA twigs since 2014
Bruno 2010
Weeknd 2011
Billie 2018The big country artists almost all use rap drums
In 2025 hip hop took up 24% of all music market share aka 1 in 4 streams overall
Catalogue and legacy acts having more pull isn’t exclusive to hip-hop and a “decline” commercially is only significant relative to the fact hip hop had a iron grip commercially that barely let other genres breath since like 2017 it’s simply becoming less overwhelmingly dominant that’s not the same as something dying
More audiences are being better represented by streaming and genre representation is becoming more broad to represent dif types of audiences because ur not having every gated community white kid bumping Travis Scott and unable to listen to something if it don’t have an 808. Hip hop historically is just really exceptional in turns of having high turnover rates. Hip hop also is letting its legends age and treating them with respect now and there’s more lanes for older and younger folks so naturally that means more of a split pie commercially.
Yeah all of this should be thought about a bit more
- ·1 replylonny860
If you read the initial message, I said that it's pretty hard to get there when Rap Media/The Industry/The Internet are in shambles. It takes longer now..and some of the people that were getting really close died in towards the end of the last decade..that was a BIG setback. Pop Smoke, X, Juice Wrld, Lil Peep. They wouldve been critical pieces in how rap wouldve have matured in alternative spaces.
Kanye Drake Jay etc..all were able to benefit from those things (media, radio, tv exsposure, authority at the record labels) with a way more concentrated market.
We are in different times. It takes longer. It takes built in communities that are mature and understand and champion rap.
So when people s*** on the underground rappers it makes no sense. They are the ones that will be on those stages and have the best chances of being huge. (Ken Carson, Nine Vicious, Destroy Lonely, Che, etc)
People just want them to be/look like traditional rap artists. That is dead.
and then it's like..Lil Baby, Playboi Carti, NBA YoungBoy, and Lil Uzi exist...do these artists just mean nothing? are these not huge names produced in the last decade?
Do we seriously think there wont be more stars in rap? lol
They s*** on the underground rappers because they f***ing suck, or are good beat pickers at best.
·2 repliesI don’t think these fried Gen Z audiences have attention spans wide enough for lyrical music anymore
- ·3 replieseversince
I don’t think these fried Gen Z audiences have attention spans wide enough for lyrical music anymore
The other issue is that the next artists in line do not have influences that go back further enough in time. They grew up listening to soundcloud 2016 and on wards so that’s who they mimic. sounds like a vicious cycle the more we move forward in time
- ·1 reply
S*** like this don’t happen anymore…
- eversince
I don’t think these fried Gen Z audiences have attention spans wide enough for lyrical music anymore
overly simplistic way of looking at an entire generation of people, theres always gonna be ebbs and flows
Knew it was dead once that "O-way" nonsense started picking up.
·2 repliesWho’s saying it’s dead? What’s their rationale? And what replaced it? From rock to disco to pop, hair metal to grunge to alternative and back to pop, it’s all been pretty clear cut. In the modern era we have several genres coexisting on the charts, and it’s going to stay that way for the foreseeable future.
·4 replies·Â✦crazy thing is modern audiences would now consider Teflon Don, Thank Me Later, King, etc "lyrical miracle"
- dustyunc93
crazy thing is modern audiences would now consider Teflon Don, Thank Me Later, King, etc "lyrical miracle"
If Kirko Bangs was still alive Nettspend would be working at Sweetgreen
