So are you a pacifist?

isnt true anarchy basically just Mad Max

So you believe in puntive justice? What that CEO did is bad, and he shoukd be made to see it was bad, and then free to join and participate in society and the politics thereof. What, you think he should be forced to live in a dirt hole or something for the rest of his life to show him the error of his ways? Idgi

At heart, but I recognize violence is sometimes necessary. If society deems it necessary, that is, not a state

I think a lot of things should happen to the people that have wrecked this earth and forced people to suffer under oppression.

It’s more like The Jetsons

I don’t believe in punishment for the sake of pumishment. If a criminal is a constant threat to society then yeah remove them from society or rehabilitate them until they’re no longer a threat. But oppressing someone just because they did a morally objectionable thing? Then youre the morally objectionable one.

lmaoo

could we tag @Yuzzy too so its not a gangpile

debate the fascist at first? you already lost at that point cause the fascist don’t see y’all as humans and would absolutely take advantage of that.

also what if the landlords for example refuse to be expropriated after the vote, after all they own the land, they have the money, they have the real power in that direct democracy they can easily overthrow y’all, with the means of mercenaries and gathering of reactionary forces.

Like Synopsis said the USSR was at war with 20 different countries, once the capitalist are over thrown in one nation they international capitalist will fight back with 20x the force

this is marxist-leninism in a nutshell though?

i’m genuinely interested in Sniper thoughts that’s why i @ him idrc for Yuzzy lol

The state in one form or another is inevitable.

all this thread is doing is making me appreciate the USSR even more with the challenges they had to face

No, the people arent the state. Thats the big illusion ML’s have, that the people have control of the state as if it were a tool. It’s just oppression, and I don’t want people to be oppressed, even if they say theyre doing it for my benefit to people who reaaaally really deserve it. Don’t you think it’s a slippery slope, like lets kill all the fascists okay now lets kill all their sympathizers until finally youre just murdering everyone who has a bad thing to say about the government

Just because it seems to always come about doesn’t mean society cant change that, and it DEFINITELY doesnt mean its a good thing or something that should be strived towards

just curious on ur definition on what the state is

An organized society with rules that are enforced

Sure, no one said it wouldnt be a struggle. No one said it would be easy. No one’s like oh there will be no conflict, but if that conflict arises it will be the conflict of a liberated people and thats something to be applauded.

Debate the fascist. Yes! Allow them to voice their grievances, allow them to challenge the status quo. Allow anyone who disagrees to chime in and address the way society functions. Thats liberty!

I would say the state is any facility with the legitimized means of violence, and I don’t think anything except the people should decide where violence is directed

So a group of people deciding how to enforce the rules
Sounds like a state

If you start oppressing the bourgeois, don’t they immediately stop being powerful landlords or CEOs or whatever and just end up people in poverty like the proles oncr were? Why not just forgive their sins and try to show them the right way

have you read State & Revolution?

Not some people, ALL people, with all viewpoints included in a consensus form based of decision making. No putting the power in the hands of a select few, even if they were supposedly democratically elected

the thread at this point