I provided 3 examples of how they were behind innovations that's still being used in music today and you just ignored it I'm not even talking about their actual music, just the ideas they had. It's objectively incorrect to say they had no technical innovations and no creative depth
Who gaf about 20 minute songs when a song off DAMN, one of the biggest albums of the past few years and highest rated albums of all time, used a technique attributed to the Beatles
Every arrangement of that period - the harpsichords and the flutes, the prerecorded tracks and the electronic effects - was the result of George Martin's careful production. Martin was a lay musician, a former member of a marching band that occasionally had played in St. James Park. He knew that avantgarde musicians made music by manipulating tracks, that instruments with unusual timbre existed, that rock bands were dissecting classical harmonies. His background, not to mention his intellectual ability, was of the circus, the carnival, the operetta, the marching band, London's second-rate theaters. He took all he could from that folkloristic patrimony, every unorthodox technique. The results might not have been particularly impressive - after all he was neither Beethoven nor Von Karajan - but they were most certainly interesting. He was the true genius behind the music of the Beatles. Martin transformed their snobbish disposition, their childish insolence, their fleeting enthusiasm, into musical ideas. He converted their second hand melodies into monumental arrangements. He even played some of the instruments that helped those songs make history. From Rubber Soul on, Martin's involvement got progressively more evident. Especially with Sgt. Pepper, Martin demonstrated his knowledge and his intuition. The idea to connect all the songs in a continuous flow, however, is McCartney's. It is the operetta syndrome, the everlasting obsession of British musicians of the music halls. The Beatles filled newspapers and magazines with their declarations about d**** and Indian mysticism, and how they converted those elements into music, but it was Martin who was doing the conversion, who was transforming their fanciful artistic ambitions into music.
The fact that so many books still name the Beatles as "the greatest or most significant or most influential" rock band ever only tells you how far rock music still is from becoming a serious art. The Beatles sold a lot of records not because they were the greatest musicians but simply because their music was easy to sell to the masses: it had no difficult content, it had no technical innovations, it had no creative depth. They wrote a bunch of catchy 3-minute ditties and they were photogenic. If somebody had not invented "Beatlemania" in 1963, you would not have wasted five minutes of your time reading these pages about such a trivial band.
This is just untrue and i dont even like Beatles that much
Every arrangement of that period - the harpsichords and the flutes, the prerecorded tracks and the electronic effects - was the result of George Martin's careful production. Martin was a lay musician, a former member of a marching band that occasionally had played in St. James Park. He knew that avantgarde musicians made music by manipulating tracks, that instruments with unusual timbre existed, that rock bands were dissecting classical harmonies. His background, not to mention his intellectual ability, was of the circus, the carnival, the operetta, the marching band, London's second-rate theaters. He took all he could from that folkloristic patrimony, every unorthodox technique. The results might not have been particularly impressive - after all he was neither Beethoven nor Von Karajan - but they were most certainly interesting. He was the true genius behind the music of the Beatles. Martin transformed their snobbish disposition, their childish insolence, their fleeting enthusiasm, into musical ideas. He converted their second hand melodies into monumental arrangements. He even played some of the instruments that helped those songs make history. From Rubber Soul on, Martin's involvement got progressively more evident. Especially with Sgt. Pepper, Martin demonstrated his knowledge and his intuition. The idea to connect all the songs in a continuous flow, however, is McCartney's. It is the operetta syndrome, the everlasting obsession of British musicians of the music halls. The Beatles filled newspapers and magazines with their declarations about d**** and Indian mysticism, and how they converted those elements into music, but it was Martin who was doing the conversion, who was transforming their fanciful artistic ambitions into music.
Lmao, John Lennon and Paul McCartney must have run a train on your mom or something Done with this conversation, you're a moron
Stormzy and Skepta could have easily crossed over to the US if Americans were as receptive of UK hiphop as they are now
This is just untrue and i dont even like Beatles that much
Keep living in fantasy land. The Beatles had the historical function to delay the impact of the innovations of the 1960s . Between 1966 and 1969, while suites, jams, and long free form tracks (which the Beatles also tried but only toward the end of their career) became the fashion, while the world was full of guitarists, bassist, singers and drummers who played solos and experimented with counterpoint, the Beatles limited themselves to keeping the tempo and following the melody. Their historical function was also to prepare the more conservative audience for those innovations. Their strength was perhaps in being the epitome of mediocrity, never a flash of genius, never a revolutionary thought, never a step away from what was standard, accepting innovations only after they had been by the establishment. And maybe it was that chronic mediocrity that made their fortune: whereas other bands tried to surpass their audiences, to keep two steps ahead of the myopia of their fans, traveling the hard and rocky road, the Beatles took their fans by the hand and walked them along a straight path devoid of curves and slopes.
Today Beatles songs are played mostly in supermarkets. But their myth, like that of Rudolph Valentino and Frank Sinatra before them, will live as long as the fans who believed in it will be alive. Through the years their fame has been artificially kept alive by marketing, a colossal advertising effort, a campaign without equal in the history of entertainment.
Lmao, John Lennon and Paul McCartney must have run a train on your mom or something Done with this conversation, you're a moron
It’s funny you mention that, as The Beatles would never do something so daring as to have unhinged promiscuous s***such as you’re describing. The songs of the Beatles were equipped with fairly vapid lyrics at a time when hordes of singer songwriters and bands were trying to say something intelligent. The Beatles' lyrics were tied to the tradition of pop music, while rock music found space, rightly or wrongly, for psychological narration, anti-establishment satire, political denunciation, d****, s***and death.
Beatles fans can change the meaning of the word "artistic" to suit themselves, but the truth is that the artistic value of the Beatles work is very low. The Beatles made only songs, often unpretentious songs, with melodies no more catchy than those of many other pop singers. The artistic value of those songs is the artistic value of one song: however well done (and one can argue over the number of songs well done vs. the number of overly publicized songs by the band of the moment), it remains a song, precisely as toothpaste remains toothpaste. It does not become a work of art just because it has been overly publicized.
The British accent while rapping sounds “hard” to Brits but it sounds corny to Americans.
They don’t have to be as big as the Beatles. Just someone that causes the average American listener to start paying attention to UK rap. The same way the Beatles paved the way for the Stones, Zepplin, and Pink Floyd
You have to be that big to get a whole nation and culture to go out of their way a f*** with rap from a different nation. As of now cities in the US are still fighting for the top spot.
The u.s fw w UK rap will happened one day, the UK already got a lot of momentum out here in 2020-21 they used to hate on southern accents too
unless british rappers change up their style I dont' see it happening. the style of rapping in the UK is weird and off putting for a lot of people kinda similar to how danny brown is an amazing rapper but a lot of people don't like his voice (for the record I love danny)
but anyways I could see a Drake or Post Malone type of UK "rapper" become huge. type of person that kinda sings more than raps and makes poppy stuff
UK rappers having the confidence to rap in a way that is as influenced by garage, jungle, grime and general soundsystem culture as it is hip hop is what makes it special though.
If they lost their sound and all the British reference points what would be the point of them existing
UK rappers are doing more collabs in the US now but you guys over there tend to be more pressed about us breaking in the US than we are. It was a bigger conversation some years ago because a lot of artists thought that they could only make money in the US so they were using American accents when rapping but as the UK scene has grown a lot more artists are realizing that while breaking the US would be nice it's not a necessity especially when it comes to them making money off of their music.
M.I.A. came the closest, but it probably won't happen. Maybe a melodic rapper who watered down the cultural references could do it.
That being said, who knows. ASAP Rocky's biggest song since his first album is basically a Skepta song lol. Skepta beat, feature and some of his sound. That shows it's a little possible
Lancey
Lancey hasn't even broken the UK yet let alone the US. But he's probably the kind of rapper who could do it.
But does it even count if they don't sound that British in their music or use UK sounds lol
You have to be sniffing glue if you think Dave is on the same tier rapping wise as corny ass Big Sean
he's better than Sean but i don't think he's even a top 10 UK MC, i don't get the obsession
@DontAtMe i really can't believe these dudes let you go 3 pages quoting that Piero Scaruffi article : lmaooo.
I'll shoot myself in the head before tea and crumpets man becomes the face of rap.
Just give us their nice drill producers and them trash UK rappers in their land.