Yes. It was there in the mid 2010’s off the backs of Ye Wayne 50 Em and then Kendrick Drake Cole upholding that and then the niggas who said the gatekeepers were old haters for requiring fundamentals and introspection (Uzi and Yachty vividly did that to Ebro and Joe Budden) took this s*** off the rails to our current place

They had hip hop at the top and at its peak mixture of mainstream easy listening fluff/tricks/ear candy mixed with the meat and potatoes / substance and our generation (niggas in they early 20’s or younger in 2016) ruined it. NOT gatekeeping is why hip hop is no longer at the top spot lol

So many rappers that we rate highly or even consider legends treated hip hop as a hustle to get rich from. The only difference is they were better lyricists/technical rappers.

The whole “treating hip hop as a lick” s*** is a non issue imo

I agree, its my fault

he's literally the blame

He and Biden are too sensitive are want to be liked too much while pretending they don’t care about being liked, to the point that every time they began trying to serve as the much needed gatekeepers they backed down and apologized

It’s a balance. We need the pharrell to encourage the weirdos and we need the others to bully the weirdos. If everyone says it’s ok to be yourself we’re gonna get a lot of weirdo s*** on the airwaves

Woat post I know but it’s true. I don’t necessarily dislike weirdo rap but to accept weirdos, quality was a requirement. Some legends weren’t even accepted because too weird. Nowadays the requirement is being a weirdo and quality is seen as an anti aura

Vibe rap always been a thing. Southern Music involving selling d**** been a thing for a while (even before Trap Music). Thot rap has always been a thing with women like Trina and Lil Kim (although she was by far more lyrical with it).

Labels

Social Media

Those are the two are at fault. Blatantly obvious by what's considered the new "underground" which is just soundcloud rap rebranded for tiktok but arguably worse depending on the artist. Labels went crazy with signing anyone who had any buzz trying to capitalize off of singles, and started prioritizing data a***ytics instead of the music.

A LOT of these labels don't know how to market black music. The most successful artists came from black label heads, who know how to push the music they were trying to get across. P with Quality Control. Steven Victor with Pop Smoke. Durk with Von. Gucci with damn near everybody in Atlanta. Top Dog with Kendrick, Q, and SZA.

We need a music first approach, which we won't get due to venture capitalists taking over the labels.

everyone laser focuses on hip hop for so many critiques and shortcomings but if you zoom the lens out a bit, music and art is in a decline mainly in terms of marketability and staying power. We don’t even need to get into the actual music. Good music is always out there if you really care. It’s just a factor of how it’s consumed and accessed more than anything. Look at a tv show today versus the 90s early 2000s. You can argue the quality is better with better options, however with binging and so much access, a lot of it just comes and goes without much momentum or staying power for many.

Within music itself there’s rarely a gradual build to greatness or artist development bc that’s not what is going to pay off. Often times it’s not rewarded. Music for most people is an accessory to their social media presentation. As much as a photo filter. There’s a lot of turnover outside of the few artists who spent years and years nourishing a fan base and more importantly maturing with their fan base and holding their attention. Historically, most of the greatest musicians of all time, their debut albums were nowhere near the successes that their album 5 or 6 years later were.

So it’s not really a hip hop exclusive problem but just how the world interacts with music and art now.

Crazy that as soon as hip hop turned its back on kanye, it started to decline

Yeah blame people for liking music, thats a big brained move

as if he ain't been dropping stinkers for a hot minute now, he's part of the decline if anything

Kanye was part of the decline
He decided to platform Lil Pump and Desiigner, when there were so many actual young talented cool artists

I dont think he has forum people in mind

Its funny how this happens every decade in hip hop. The oversaturated commodification of the genre. Rappers Delight had a lot of controversy for this, so did the commercialisation of the genre in the 90s via major labels coming through. Then the ringtone era in the 00s

We just waiting on the next wave to switch up the mainstream message. Wont be surprised if it gets more socio-political and thats what resonates with people, happened with The Message in the 80s (then NWA with the gangster rap in the late 80s), Lyricist Lounge in the late 90s

They ain’t stinkers though, you all just judge antics and media fed narratives not actual music.

The decline of hip hop is believing this narrative that it is declining that the marketing creates not the actual music, the sonics are better today than ever.

And nothing came of those two, what’s your point?

Kanye has been putting on people forever, the good ones make something of themselves, the bad ones don’t.

nigga YOU MADE THE SANDWICH

what does "the sonics are better today than ever" mean tho

I can't think of a single rapper that was big around 2016-2018 that's making better music today than back then

It’s not just execs. It can be the music fans too. We have to stop giving attention to rappers who don’t care about the culture. That’s the only way they thrive in the social media era, giving them the attention and views.

But with social media comes everyone and their opinion. And this is why some kid from Iowa can cook up a weak ass song and post it online for anyone to see.

That’s were the problem comes in. Because back in the day, we didn’t have social media. You had to physically go out and make a name for yourself. Think about that story were Big Sean rapped for Kanye or J Cole going to NYC to try to get his music to the Roc.

We as online music fans have to stand up now. It falls on us to be the gatekeepers.

The beats sound way more crisp and cleaner to me now.

Kanye has suffered from the culture turning its back on him, people not clearing samples, samples being removed from songs after release(such as I thought about Killing you), people not being allowed to work with him cause of where they are signed. All of this is a result of the industry vs Kanye.

To answer the 2nd question, Kendrick. The songs released in this beef are just as well articulated, planned and layered as anything out of GKMC but the subject matter/themes may not seem as “important” although I think they are.

they started turning back in 2018 after Slaverygate, and 2019 & 2020 were some of hip hop's biggest years

Juan Epstein >>>

Cipha Sounds >>> Ebro

I agree it's all higher quality but it's almost like these artists are focusing too much on the quality & not enough on actually making fun/replayable music

then you have a lot of rappers that have moved away from having fun, to instead focusing way more on getting their bars off (Cole, Sean, Drake etc)

I’ll agree with the fun, replayable stuff for the most part. Although I can play Not Like Us all day.

kanye turned his back on pretty much everyone…not the other way around dude. I literally swear by yes first 5 albums and ksg as well. If you think he hasn’t been a complete ass hat the last 6-7 years though you are lying to yourself. You can only run with the eccentric a****** act long enough before people get sick and tired, especially when the music that used to endear you to the fans who overlooked stuff in the past starts to decline.