If you really feel like MBDTF is pseudo art trying to convince people it’s a masterpiece, you have to feel that way about Pablo too. Some parts are maybe edgier and artsier but it also might be even more commercial than MBDTF. The recent twitter praise for TLOP reminds me of MBDTF reception. I think they’re both great and valid but if you’re going to say MBDTF isn’t art then TLOP isn’t even art adjacent

Yeah sure OP. Ye, the 8th solo, was a bold piece of artistic freedom and bravoure. Definitely not a compilation of poor lyricism, ultra conventional beats and barstool psychology.

LOL

TLOP > Yeezus

this thread will age well

If spoiled milk does

Commercial ≠ pseudo art

MBDTF has the “artsy” album cover, the “artsy” album title, the “artsy” short film (which is not even that good tbh except for the Runaway segment).

Also, what’s up with Who Will Survive in America? What is the purpose of putting that speech at the end?

I remember an 808s era interview when Ye said that people were criticizing him because he went “pop”, as if pop wasn’t art. However, he called 808s art pop and said that the only reason people don’t consider mainstream/pop stuff art is because it’s usually not good, and THEN he said that people’s perception of what they consider art is usually some underground, dark s***... and that’s EXACTLY what he did on MBDTF, he played with people’s perceptions, he made that album for the people, not for himself. I don’t see the same thing in Pablo at all.

I would love to hear your reasoning behind the fact that you think Ye is a compilation of poor lyricism.

Why having ultra conventional beats necessarily mean is bad? My whole argument is that Kanye gets better with time as an artist. If he had conventional beats on that album is because he wanted it that way, that’s his artistic choice, is not because he can’t make non conventional beats (Daytona, KSG, XTCY were made around the same time).

What do you mean by barstool psychology?

Would’ve been right if Yeezus is 1

It is.
Dont quote me

808s is Kanye’s best project and to all you dust heads don’t quote me

I quote u and agree

Guys I think op is drunk

Kanye's discog so goat that for the most part, I can usually understand or accept anyone rankings. But you couldn't make a worse ranking than OPs if you tried.

Imagine thinking ye is better than Yeezus Tlop and Mbdtf

MBDTF is overrated. The big singles overshadow the body of work. Take runaway, all of the lights, and power off and the album is okay not great!

JIK is Kanye’s worse album

lock thread, OP get help

op has some good points tho bout perception management kanye didn’t go release ye with the idea that he knew y’all would like it more than mbdtf, but yet most music audiences think about albums in a narrowly linear sense, where each succeeding album should be “better” than the previous. typically how they define better is paradoxical and i think ye knows that, which is why he strives for different instead of being more market oriented

Hopefully OP catches COVID

Go f*** yourself.

You are the only one who got the point so far

Yeah you're right. Gorgeous, Devil in a New Dress, Dark Fantasy, Lost in the World and every other great song on the album really make MBDTF an overall stinker.

"He was about to do the same s*** on the 7th solo (Pusha was right when he said that album was going to be better than MBDTF) but he changed his mind and went for the art (and THEN he regretted that, Pablo era is Kanye’s craziest yet {which one/which one})."

this paragraph tho -- what did u mean when you said that kanye regretted making TLOP for the art? or is that not what ur saying

Yeah that’s what I said. It’s just my assumption tho (everything in OP is assumptions).

I think that with So Help Me God/Swish he was going for a Graduation 2 type of album (I believe Tony Williams even referred to it as Kanye’s Thriller). He wanted to get back on the radio again.

I’m just assuming he regretted not doing that because on the Charlamagne interview he expressed how he missed the times of Grad where almost all his songs were hits.

But now that I think about it better, I think he went for both: art and success. Sort of like what he attempted on MBDTF, but with Pablo he found a better balance between both (Pablo’s artistry is more honest than MBDTF’s, which is more pretentious imo).