black hedi slimane

2y

i agree i do feel like we need the gadfly socrates talked about that provokes thought and gets us to question all these things we take for granted, accept as okay (if that’s what you’re getting at)

but at the same time i think where we disagree is does he have any responsibility for the violence (physical, emotional, whatever) that comes out of rhetoric like this

i don’t have a good argument against it rn bc i’m watching better call saul rn and atp i’m kinda losing steam on this

i do agree with the sentiments y’all bring up, but idek anymore

Fries

2y

Also I feel like a lot of these arguments are overlooking the Holocaust stuff, the man really seems to have an issue with it and Jews 'controlling the history books', that part doesn't seem possible to spin as an 'I'll say anything!' shock tactic, he seemed to really want to get into that before he got cut off, and it makes his statements about Hitler and the Nazis seem like way less of an empty provocation, I think the truth is that he was playing up a lot of what he was saying for maximum offense and shock value, but is also an anti-semite who admires Hitler, like he's having his cake and eating it

cold mountain

2y

the thing is, he's not really a Nazi

and you're probably right, us talking about it definitely helps further his right-wing goals. But so does calling him a Nazi. Ye is quite literally banking on you calling him a Nazi, that's the entire purpose of this strategy. If he's not actually a Nazi, but the left calls him a Nazi, well, we have the recipe Trump used to get into the white house.

necromancer

2y

accelerationism is psuedo-intellectual bullshit

NunTheWiser

2y

Man f*** this s***, what the f*** is a “real nazi”? A soldier that shot or raped a Jew in a camp? Yes, but that’s not all, man, anyone that even remotely supported that regime was / is a Nazi. The measuring tape for being a Nazi isn’t if you’re a murderer or not, it’s if you support the Nazi fascist regime.

And enough of this “he doesn’t ACTUALLYYYYYYY believe XYZ”, it doesn’t f***ing matter what someone actually believes if what is coming out of their mouth is contrary.

Stop telling me what he actually believes like you’re a f***ing mind reader my guy. The s*** he is saying is stupid, dangerous, and bad. That’s it. Literal end of story. Stop with these giant walls of text about what he ACTUALLY means. Stop saying it’s all about love. Loving everyone is cool, but it’s a f***ing facade when in the past few months you’ve talked s*** on Jews and praised Hitler.

AshTheRobot

2y

I legit can't wrap my head around WHY he wants to be in the depressing world of politics....

In the good timeline he'd be taking 4 year breaks between albums right now, chillen with his kids, and having Sunday brunches with Jay and Beyonce every week.

If this was really about helping ppl, he could have offered significantly more help to the black youth as rapper Kanye West, than he ever would as President Kanye West...

Just makes me sad that he legit burned all of his bridges just like that.

Killed every single REAL friendship that he had in the industry.

He's probably not worried about it now.... but I'm quite sure once's his kids are old enough to understand how badly he harrassed Kim, and see all of these comments, his relationship with them will become strained. Especially if he doesn't make an effort to change(which he won't).

It's honestly just depressing how he's going to be walking through life with no genuine relationships.

Fries

2y

Why are you specifying anti-Mossad here? He only found out who Benjamin Netanyahu was 2 weeks ago, his beef with him genuinely seems to be that he has a funny name and he's Jewish, maybe I missed something but he barely mentions Mossad at all, his problems seem to be with Jewish people as a whole

cold mountain

2y

lmao u have not been listening. This is most definitely anti-mossad.

and do you really earnestly believe he only found out who Netanyahu was 2 weeks ago?

HaroldsChicken

2y

I get what you are saying but he knows Holocaust denial is illegal some places would draw more of a reaction than everything he says thus far and insinuates "if they could alter history in 1945 image what they are altering now"

NunTheWiser

2y

Man f*** this s***, what the f*** is a “real nazi”? A soldier that shot or raped a Jew in a camp? Yes, but that’s not all, man, anyone that even remotely supported that regime was / is a Nazi. The measuring tape for being a Nazi isn’t if you’re a murderer or not, it’s if you support the Nazi fascist regime.

And enough of this “he doesn’t ACTUALLYYYYYYY believe XYZ”, it doesn’t f***ing matter what someone actually believes if what is coming out of their mouth is contrary.

Stop telling me what he actually believes like you’re a f***ing mind reader my guy. The s*** he is saying is stupid, dangerous, and bad. That’s it. Literal end of story. Stop with these giant walls of text about what he ACTUALLY means. Stop saying it’s all about love. Loving everyone is cool, but it’s a f***ing facade when in the past few months you’ve talked s*** on Jews and praised Hitler.

NunTheWiser

2y

Man f*** this s***, what the f*** is a “real nazi”? A soldier that shot or raped a Jew in a camp? Yes, but that’s not all, man, anyone that even remotely supported that regime was / is a Nazi. The measuring tape for being a Nazi isn’t if you’re a murderer or not, it’s if you support the Nazi fascist regime.

And enough of this “he doesn’t ACTUALLYYYYYYY believe XYZ”, it doesn’t f***ing matter what someone actually believes if what is coming out of their mouth is contrary.

Stop telling me what he actually believes like you’re a f***ing mind reader my guy. The s*** he is saying is stupid, dangerous, and bad. That’s it. Literal end of story. Stop with these giant walls of text about what he ACTUALLY means. Stop saying it’s all about love. Loving everyone is cool, but it’s a f***ing facade when in the past few months you’ve talked s*** on Jews and praised Hitler.

Fries

2y

In the stream though he literally gets cut off by that Ali guy saying that Ye doesn't have to explain himself, almost like he was trying to preserve his reputation from being seen to condone a Holocaust denier, so he swooped in before Ye could finish, like he literally takes Ye's mic, it's not Kanye self-censoring at all

And I basically agree with your post, I think that he's trying to say exactly that, but IMO that's clearly straightforward anti-semitic propaganda and far beyond the realm of the 'playing with language' ideas that have been thrown back and forth here, he's not doing this with any grander plan atm, he's currently out of his mind and is espousing his actual anti-semitic beliefs while revelling in the controversy they cause if you ask me

I feel like everyone should actually look back at the stream because it doesn't come across as a guy with a plan at all, dude veers from Jared Kushner fashion deals to 'the CIA are trying to kill me' to 'Hitler was a really cool leader', to 'I wanna see my Momma' and begging people to kill him to reading off anti-semitic jokes written by an alt-right comedian about Ben Shapiro, to waving a net around and making it talk with an Elmo voice, this is not 5D chess

cold mountain

2y

I agree with you that its dangerous

I agree with you that you don't have to kill someone to be a Nazi

I agree with you that I can't read Ye's mind

STILL, he isn't literally a nazi. Yes, he's flirting with far-right and antisemitic groups. But if you actually listen to what he has to say, it soon becomes clear that he doesn't want to do what Hitler did. Guy's simply not a Nazi.

And you must understand. Ye's strategy will work even if he's only the tiniest bit away from being a Nazi. All he needs is for liberals to call him a Nazi when he technically isn't one. He already technically isn't one, and nothing you do can change that. Calling him a Nazi and saying "fuck being nuanced about this" is legitimately exactly what he wants you to do. It will only galvanize his supporters and make him seem more credible when he says the left is out to get him.

Are you going to de exactly what Ye wants you to do, or will you show that you can be nuanced about things?

HaroldsChicken

2y

See I think this is where it gets interesting though because at its core Nazism is just Hyper Nationalism that in its case was specified by the German People. Modern day america is still a form of Nazism. We are a hyper nationalist country with bases around the world, killed millions of Muslims, Abu Gharib looks like anything Nazis would do , extreme torture blacksites all of those things. yet we are still taught to not as much question it or our country. We not saying what ye says 100% but rather the contradictions he ironically points out in our reality.

We or at least I am not in anyway cosigning hate speech, persecution of anyone or violence. He is wearing an American Flag and going to churches but saying he a Nazi . That is ridiculous in itself

cold mountain

2y

I agree with you that its dangerous

I agree with you that you don't have to kill someone to be a Nazi

I agree with you that I can't read Ye's mind

STILL, he isn't literally a nazi. Yes, he's flirting with far-right and antisemitic groups. But if you actually listen to what he has to say, it soon becomes clear that he doesn't want to do what Hitler did. Guy's simply not a Nazi.

And you must understand. Ye's strategy will work even if he's only the tiniest bit away from being a Nazi. All he needs is for liberals to call him a Nazi when he technically isn't one. He already technically isn't one, and nothing you do can change that. Calling him a Nazi and saying "fuck being nuanced about this" is legitimately exactly what he wants you to do. It will only galvanize his supporters and make him seem more credible when he says the left is out to get him.

Are you going to de exactly what Ye wants you to do, or will you show that you can be nuanced about things?

necromancer

2y

you weird f***ing prick, who cares if he reads mein kampf by hitler or revolt against the modern world by evola or not

HE IS BRINGING THOSE FORCES OUT OF THE F***ING GROUND AND IT WILL HURT PEOPLE, BLACK PEOPLE BROWN PEOPLE JEWISH PEOPLE WHITE PEOPLE THEY SEE AS "RACE TRAITORS"

HE LITERALLY DOES NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT THE F*** HES PLAYING WITH, BUT HIS NEW "FRIENDS" DO AND THEY ARE EXPLOITING THAT

necromancer

2y

you weird f***ing prick, who cares if he reads mein kampf by hitler or revolt against the modern world by evola or not

HE IS BRINGING THOSE FORCES OUT OF THE F***ING GROUND AND IT WILL HURT PEOPLE, BLACK PEOPLE BROWN PEOPLE JEWISH PEOPLE WHITE PEOPLE THEY SEE AS "RACE TRAITORS"

HE LITERALLY DOES NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT THE F*** HES PLAYING WITH, BUT HIS NEW "FRIENDS" DO AND THEY ARE EXPLOITING THAT

cold mountain

2y

lmao u have not been listening. This is most definitely anti-mossad.

and do you really earnestly believe he only found out who Netanyahu was 2 weeks ago?

Fries

2y

Yes man, I honestly do believe that the guy who doesn't read books and is in the below video didn't know who Benjamin Netanyahu was until 2 weeks ago, I think to an extent this is like trying to divine meaning from the ramblings of a Holy Fool, he genuinely doesn't seem that smart, he dodged every actual serious policy question, mentioned Palestine maybe once and didn't come across like that was his focus at all, dude's just a historically illiterate moron who hates Jews, he thinks Hitler invented the highway

HaroldsChicken

2y

I mean this gets into do you think Ye is possibly a fascist or would part of his goal when rising to power be to create many executive actions to change America for the worse. There is truthfully no way to know . We have so many checks and balances, administrations and as he says "handlers" that even when someone is president they dont really have full control to ruin the country or be authoritarian because we all have free will. Same as we had under Trump

HaroldsChicken

2y

That is exactly what I am getting at. He once said "why do we tell kids how to act" and he lives by that in his mind we should be able to question anything and everything including ourselves. That dumb questions have more value than silence or being afraid of offending people in control.

All love and I do understand those that believe he would have a responsibility for his influence and violence. I just don't like getting to that direction because then it often deflects from the person doing it itself it becomes the devil, nra, right wing , alt right, qanon, trump, ye, mental health, pills, alcohol made someone do something versus their own brain

cold mountain

2y

cmon bruh why are u getting emotional now, I'm on your side.

I agree that he's playing with dangerous forces. Populism, especially the way he's doing it, is akin to black magic. It's bad stuff.

But I'm telling you, calling him a Nazi only furthers his agenda.

Fries

2y

Yes man, I honestly do believe that the guy who doesn't read books and is in the below video didn't know who Benjamin Netanyahu was until 2 weeks ago, I think to an extent this is like trying to divine meaning from the ramblings of a Holy Fool, he genuinely doesn't seem that smart, he dodged every actual serious policy question, mentioned Palestine maybe once and didn't come across like that was his focus at all, dude's just a historically illiterate moron who hates Jews, he thinks Hitler invented the highway