Dont need to be "scientific" to state the obvious.

chinhnghia.com/Passages%20from%20Antiquity%20to%20Feudalism.PDF

here's some spicy reading material for yall, Passages by Perry Anderson, which a***yzes the development of feudalism out of ancient slave societies

capitalism is inherently unsustainable purely at the level of mathematics but ard buddy , you stay thinkin you have one

It's been a success story. 99% of the time it transitioned into globalist capitalism that all the former "Communist" party leaders profit of. It's any oligarch's wet dream.
1. Make your own party, promise everyone a piece of the pie while telling the voters they'll eventually own it all.
2. Win election and nationalize everything.
3. Have party insiders control the most important industries.
4. Abolish socialism and privatize but keep old party insiders in control.

The easiest way to smoothly transition into a kleptocracy.

Lol

The underlying pattern of this thread is that you guys are in complete denial about what Socialism looks like in the real world vs your philosophical, idealistic wet dreams. It has failed in every country it has been tried and the few countries that still have it are in the process of privatizing. Cuba's updated constitution add the right to private property.

This thread would be better if it was called Communism thread to be more inclusive of the many other equally valid and clever ideas, local and global, industrial and environmental, collectivist and individual list, on how to reach the goal of a classless, stateless egalitarian society.

pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/06/29/in-russia-nostalgia-for-soviet-union-and-positive-feelings-about-stalin

thread would be better if you didnt post in it

Examples of Alternate forms of transitioning besides Marxism itt:

1. Reformism/ Social Democracy / Market Socialism
2. Anarchism / Mutualism
3. Accelerationism
4. Degrowth
5. Communalism / Democratic Confederalism
6. Luxury Communism

All these US plebs in the thread 🤮 try to get on Canada’s level first

imagine not having healthcare

Y'all would cry how the sindicatos in México, especially the teachers union is misusing Marxist ideology as a smokescreen to profit and part of the students are blindly following them.
Instead of exchanging information and validating yourselves in this thread, which is very honorable and important indeed, you should go out there and explain/teach these people how these ideas can be put into practice. Sheep will still be sheep, even if their wool is coloured red.

social democracy is explicitly not a transition to socialism and the rest of these are just weird fantasies, number 6 is literally a meme

They are way too anti-social to do that. Do you think even half of them have ever volunteered? Much less abroad? This is some kind of Anti-Social Socialist Club.

Thank you. Everything said.

I don't know, because I don't know the people in this thread personally. I understand that classbased societies are a problem, but when you start traveling around, working in projects etc. you realize that putting these ideas into practice is way harder than discussing them in your university group or in a reading circle.

Also, not everyone has the same ability to understand concepts like these or even have a common definition, you have to realize you're one of the privileged fews that are either self-taught or have received an education that allows you to dissect societies and social, as well as socio-economic problems on a level as high as this. The NiNi's won't care about those great ideals when the underlying problems that fuel this bad structured society keep on existing, they will rather join the narcos first and when they're a few years in it will be too late to change their mindset, as they accepted their place in this world as mere objects, getting by every day, they rather earn 900-1200 Pesos a day with rifles in their hands, than 30-60 Pesos working on the field the whole day (and those people wont rebel, because they 1. don't know better the value of what they're doing and 2. there will be another one to take their job, maybe even for less money), because they didn't receive an education that allows them to do anything else and they also didn't receive the same input that allows them so see the world in a different perspective.

That's why change happens slowly, I don't see it happening in my lifetime, but I can try to pass on values and education that lead to critical thinking which can help the next generation build towards such a future. But for that you have to tackle the immediate problems and in a country like this, where both unions and state are profiting from a stalemate like situation in the education system, you do this either by doing independent projects yourself or by giving people, and I'm sure this will be the part where some people in this thread will crucify me, opportunities and means to move up in the current structures of a capitalistic society (f.e. access to the market, fair labour conditions or possibilities to create a sustainable living, if they have an idea help them to realize it) , so their children and their environment can understand and fight for a change. You won't change a country as corrupt as this just with mere ideals, they will be misused, just look what AMLO is doing right now.

I will also be posting in the anarchism thread as soon as I finished my travels in the pueblas, but from talking with indigenous communities I already see that there's a problem with self-governing autonomous villages who didn't receive proper education to develop a moral compass that allows them to respect each other and treat each other as equals. F.e. you have catholic communities up in the mountains that rob/discriminate families in their village who are not of their faith and punish women by tieing them to stakes, leaving them there for 3 or more days without food, because it's an old tradition. So before such a society can truly work, they themselves (not some outsider, that's colonial thinking) need to guide themselves towards something like human rights and an understanding as well as reasoning that prohibits such acts.

Tl;dr: You either read it or you don't

And yes, even with everything I wrote above, I agree with you a 100%.
It's not sustainable, whether for us as humanity nor for mother earth and her ressources. It's a race against time for us as sisters and brothers to realize this and lead ourselves to a change or exploit each others and the environment until it's too late and we either live in some kind of dystopian society or we go extinct.

@Ethic this a great write-up and I agree with you on the basics for sure. Would like to hear about your insights on pueblas just so you know. No anarchist is suggesting that we live without a moral compass or without formal education. We believe in natural hierarchies such as parenting because they are essential to pass on the right values to the next generation. The precursor of anarchism is always a democracy that helps to set up the initial institutions and protects individual rights by force and once those ideas are internalized and force is no longer necessary, Anarchists want the government to reduce its role and remove artificial hierachies in people's lives.

I said something similar like you did back on KTT1 and got called a "Liberal", "Neocon", "Anarcho-Capitalist" lmao. Your ideas are definitely far more welcome in the Anarchism thread than here, just from my experience: ktt2.com/anarchism-thread-24543

I guess just anything modern. I have trouble finding more recent stuff relating to socialism but I've read most of the classics. Hell anything by socialist scholars/authors of today is fine by me

pdfs.semanticscholar.org/40d6/b702fa28fdd1802abfb1210e10f1fa36de42.pdf

damn i was a huge socialist hater like yesterday i was s***posting for capitalism.
been reading up on arguments now and im ENLIGHTENED.

But from what i have seen most of you have been doing doing socialism dirty with some weak arguments seriously

Ty, bookmarked

You’d think maybe if the Iranian protestors were chanting for a socialist reform you all would be on their side.

You're a weirdo. Stay out this thread

glad youve got it figured out after one day, what was i doing in this communist party this whole time

@KimJongUn @Synopsis
Have you read my post about the situation in México? How do you propose a change to a true socialist society could be set in motion with the problems listed?
The both of you seem highly literate, so if you can share any information on the topic on how to tackle such corrupted structures I'll gladly accept them.
Demonstrations have been going on here in Oaxaca since 2006, people around here don't care for them anymore. The CNTE and SNTE unions have just started to use alternative textbooks in primary and secondary schools f.e. they teach children the history of Cuba and how Castro changed the lives of the poor through education. But I doubt this will change the whole society and we also know Castro didnt have the ideal answer. Especially since part of their planned curriculum seems very anachronic, like abandoning English f.e. and they're against state reformd that would weed out teachers that have inherited or bought their position and dont value nor have the qualities to work with the students. SNTE/CNTE are right in the points that the curriculum could be neoliberalized and that indigenous traditions could be lost tho. So the problem here especially in education is real complex.