OPJul 4, 2020·1 reply
wesimokay but you clearly subscribe to these ideas and if you're going to start a discussion about them you should try to defend your views, otherwise these posts are pointless.
i like the first post in this thread thoI clearly do.
Jul 4, 2020paul > john
- Jul 4, 2020·1 replySynopsis
I clearly do.
so why do you deflect everything by saying they're not your ideas
- OPJul 4, 2020wesim
so why do you deflect everything by saying they're not your ideas
im talking about the sentiment that these are somehow my original ideas that ive come to the realization of, because that is not the case.
Jul 4, 2020·1 replyThe public is subject to the most sophisticated and totalizing propaganda ever. The dignity was stripped away gradually over the course of generations. Some are too beaten down to care. Some are energized but pit against one another using cultural identifiers. Winning any political struggle is hard. It's even harder if you have some moral underpinning. Our enemies do not.
Jul 4, 2020·1 replyAm I the only one who thinks you tend get utopic over pratical, seriously bro if the worlds is f***ed do something tangible about it.... I'm not saying don't be an idealist(complain, criticize) or whatever but at least have something to show for.
- OPJul 4, 2020·1 replyMango
The public is subject to the most sophisticated and totalizing propaganda ever. The dignity was stripped away gradually over the course of generations. Some are too beaten down to care. Some are energized but pit against one another using cultural identifiers. Winning any political struggle is hard. It's even harder if you have some moral underpinning. Our enemies do not.
yup. like assata said, no one ever won their freedom by appealing to the morality of the oppressor.
- OPJul 4, 2020·1 replyKing Joffrey
Am I the only one who thinks you tend get utopic over pratical, seriously bro if the worlds is f***ed do something tangible about it.... I'm not saying don't be an idealist(complain, criticize) or whatever but at least have something to show for.
what are your suggesstions?
Jul 4, 2020
- Jul 4, 2020·1 replySynopsis
what are your suggesstions?
Am not the one who's complaining but I see you have people that follow you in here and probably irl if u keep the same energy, why not start building from there?
- Jul 4, 2020Synopsis
yup. like assata said, no one ever won their freedom by appealing to the morality of the oppressor.
Nope, but liberalism is a Blob-like monster that absorbs whoever won a victory over it, smooths that history over, and then pretends liberalism fixed itself. So anybody with a typical education doesn't realize the radical forces fought tooth and nail for everything gained and lost. They think it can be changed from inside the system. Like it's a defect and not feature.
- OPJul 4, 2020·1 replyKing Joffrey
Am not the one who's complaining but I see you have people that follow you in here and probably irl if u keep the same energy, why not start building from there?
i think follow is a bit strong of a word.
- Jul 4, 2020Synopsis
i think follow is a bit strong of a word.
Not if you really believe in what you say and want to have an impact on
Jul 4, 2020·1 replySynopsisIdk why y'all weirdos do this in every thread lol. first, these aren't my ideas. this line of thinking was mainly inspired by capitalist realism by mark fisher. the landlord thing is seen throughout socialist theories and even by guys like adam smith. the prison abolition idea is of course one found in a ton of works. no one is talking about being a genius for any of it, the issue is that some people don't realize it.
i mean isn't it kind of obvious that decades of propaganda have turned people away from communism. i dont think it speaks to a lack of imagination, it just speaks to human biases that exist in all of us.
your problem is you seem to think that aggressively throwing your ideas at people is going to make them stick. unfortunately, if you want people to actually believe that we should abolish landlords/prisons/whatever, you need to engage with their criticisms even if they're super uninformed and rooted in propaganda.
- Jul 4, 2020·edited·1 reply
In the US, the pressure is managed carefully for a large swath of the population as to leave them perpetually in distress with debt and financial anxiety but not total ruin. They still have something to lose in their minds. This new wave of joblessness is proving the fragility of what they thought they had. Whether they connect that to the booming economy for the rich or the fragrantly evil handling of the pandemic is another issue. I think it's telling all of the blowback centered around police violence on black Americans. They don't even have the vocabulary to articulate their unrest. They can see a symptom but not the disease driving it.
- OPJul 4, 2020·edited·3 repliescoltrup
i mean isn't it kind of obvious that decades of propaganda have turned people away from communism. i dont think it speaks to a lack of imagination, it just speaks to human biases that exist in all of us.
your problem is you seem to think that aggressively throwing your ideas at people is going to make them stick. unfortunately, if you want people to actually believe that we should abolish landlords/prisons/whatever, you need to engage with their criticisms even if they're super uninformed and rooted in propaganda.
its not about the propaganda turning people away from communism. its about the propaganda leading people to believe there is no conceivable alternative to capitalism, while also getting people to believe that they, the individual are in complete control, that there is no system steering them towards an outcome so to speak.
also you can go check that thread, i just talked with a guy for hours and answered any criticisms they had. but at some point, people lose the plot and place some sort of inconceivable burden as if i, or anyone else, has to have this entire new world plotted out to the most minute detail, so they just keep nitpicking and nitpicking until they can get you on the smallest little thing so they can say "see i told you it won't work because you weren't able to account for what would happen if johnny down the street couldn't have 3 pools and a bounce house in his backyard"
- Jul 4, 2020Synopsis
its not about the propaganda turning people away from communism. its about the propaganda leading people to believe there is no conceivable alternative to capitalism, while also getting people to believe that they, the individual are in complete control, that there is no system steering them towards an outcome so to speak.
also you can go check that thread, i just talked with a guy for hours and answered any criticisms they had. but at some point, people lose the plot and place some sort of inconceivable burden as if i, or anyone else, has to have this entire new world plotted out to the most minute detail, so they just keep nitpicking and nitpicking until they can get you on the smallest little thing so they can say "see i told you it won't work because you weren't able to account for what would happen if johnny down the street couldn't have 3 pools and a bounce house in his backyard"
i see. a lot of people i've talked to sort of recognize that the need to make a profit has forced them down a path that they wouldn't otherwise have taken. i agree that lot of people don't realize that, and mistakenly assume that the current system = total freedom.
one more thing ill say is
- Jul 4, 2020·1 replySynopsis
its not about the propaganda turning people away from communism. its about the propaganda leading people to believe there is no conceivable alternative to capitalism, while also getting people to believe that they, the individual are in complete control, that there is no system steering them towards an outcome so to speak.
also you can go check that thread, i just talked with a guy for hours and answered any criticisms they had. but at some point, people lose the plot and place some sort of inconceivable burden as if i, or anyone else, has to have this entire new world plotted out to the most minute detail, so they just keep nitpicking and nitpicking until they can get you on the smallest little thing so they can say "see i told you it won't work because you weren't able to account for what would happen if johnny down the street couldn't have 3 pools and a bounce house in his backyard"
you have to take accountability in the sense that a lot of people cant imagine an alternative to unfettered capitalism because you haven't really given them one.
if you cant explain the kind of economic system you want, how its achieved and how it materially works you cant blame people for struggling to imagine a life outside of this one
Jul 4, 2020MangoIn the US, the pressure is managed carefully for a large swath of the population as to leave them perpetually in distress with debt and financial anxiety but not total ruin. They still have something to lose in their minds. This new wave of joblessness is proving the fragility of what they thought they had. Whether they connect that to the booming economy for the rich or the fragrantly evil handling of the pandemic is another issue. I think it's telling all of the blowback centered around police violence on black Americans. They don't even have the vocabulary to articulate their unrest. They can see a symptom but not the disease driving it.
This
- OPJul 4, 2020·1 replycoltrup
you have to take accountability in the sense that a lot of people cant imagine an alternative to unfettered capitalism because you haven't really given them one.
if you cant explain the kind of economic system you want, how its achieved and how it materially works you cant blame people for struggling to imagine a life outside of this one
i have explained it many times
- Jul 4, 2020·1 replySynopsis
i have explained it many times
is there a thread ?
- OPJul 4, 2020·1 replycoltrup
is there a thread ?
no, but ive iterated and explained many times that its something like the abolition of wage labor and removal of the profit motive and moving towards a system based on mutual cooperation and need among the people.
Jul 4, 2020·1 replyThe thing is, their is no "better" alternative, People will be greedy and people will look after their own interests.
Are all the people who succeed in a Capitalist society evil? No
Does any alternative change human nature? No
It's not that people are not open to hear another alternative, its just that you phrase your points as if a socialistic society would cure all of the worlds problems, when that's not the case
- OPJul 4, 2020·1 replyyungboiezi
The thing is, their is no "better" alternative, People will be greedy and people will look after their own interests.
Are all the people who succeed in a Capitalist society evil? No
Does any alternative change human nature? No
It's not that people are not open to hear another alternative, its just that you phrase your points as if a socialistic society would cure all of the worlds problems, when that's not the case
you can't just sit there and say humans are inherently greedy. people look out for their own interests because that's what we're conditioned to do, but what they don't make us aware of is that the common interest and advancement of people is what is best for all of us.
plants 🌻Jul 4, 2020Another goated synopsis thread where knuckle draggers post variations of tldr memes ya just hate to f***in see it