mentioned me in the dababy thread earlier

Oooh boohooo

that was always gonna happen first few replies lol

i don't doubt it but it's pretty clear that his prominence here directly corresponds to him being 'cancelled' and ye leaning into that lol

it's weird that kanye's public persona has become more 'toxic' to liberal opinion (MAGA, slavery, Manson) as his music has become more sanitized

yes, the album is mostly all men, but - not a single outright misogynistic lyric on the album to be found from ye

Even so, here's what Gaga said without naming any producer in particular.

theguardian.com/music/2021/may/21/lady-gaga-rape-teenager-left-her-pregnant-and-caused-psychotic-break

Completely agreed, great post OP. Moral contortionism is a perfect way to put it, and it’s important that we also acknowledge that Ye is directly feeding into it.

Our culture has become so f***ing exhausting since social media and Trump. It was on a downward spiral beforehand, but this moral posturing and need for political alignment was never as front and center as it became after 2016’s election cycle. I can completely understand why it’s so fascinating to someone like Kanye who experienced “cancellation” back in 09, but by gaming it with edgelord s*** designed for a reaction he’s just throwing a match on the flames. People are now primed for outrage at all times and that can’t be f***ing healthy, but I don’t see how we can come back from it.

Huh ? What op wrote is more critical towards journalists than ye lmao

Helps that 99% of people have no clue who Dr Luke is

well then he broke into that lame stuff last paragrpah

A very good point that I don’t think many people have touched on. Reflects how things have shifted toward examining subtext first imo. Like imagine Yeezus dropping today and how people would have reacted. Hell, TLOP for that matter. People did react then, but post-Trump era would be another level

They tried to work before, but i doubt that him being cancelled heavily this year brought them into talking even more.

But i disagree its a disingenuous collab thats built soley on controversy. It can be a part tho.

op is right honestly

Which imo is because he’s a sociopath playing the game perfectly. He even changed his stage name to Tyson Trax on the newer Doja Cat stuff.

Wish Kanye would choose to call out that side of cancel culture and what’s “acceptable” for the public, but nope…

one of the better written posts I’ve seen about this topic on here. good job op

Am I supposed to assume this random producer is Dr. Luke lol?

Point is he looks like less of a rapist than niggas want to admit. Like there’s more things to suggest he’s in innocent than most people who get accused.

Kanye would invite him on stage wym lol

like if he was rapping about f***ing taylor on a song with marilyn manson in 2021 - how would people even handle that?

partly I guess Ye has let his public persona eclipse his music - as a few good reviews have pointed out, it seems sometimes like his music is secondary now to his other pursuits

but still as OP said, when you're consuming art now, you're consuming its public meaning first - how does liking/not liking this make me look?

Not to throw in the race card either, but… hard to ignore that he’d be crucified if he was black

Yeah exactly lmao. Controversial statement is his end goal, not moral statement

The wringing is on both sides, those who want to be seen as good and thus wash their hands of an artist AND those who refuse to acknowledge a wrong. What happens when your parasocial identity stand-in does something that displeases you? Suddenly you the fan f***ed up because they did.

It’s the natural curdling of celebrity/fan/stan culture from which none of us are spared. We would all, in a way that probably dates back to our parents or their parents, do well to have drastically different relationships with the art and artists we support. Sometimes it’s also not entirely up to us

i guess to tie into what i said in the OP I almost feel like dr luke being a background player rather than up front has helped in that regard too. whereas the people i mentioned had literal years to project their own views and morals onto kanye west given he was front and centre for so long.

i think it's a kinda impotent move endlessly comparing what people/outlets say about kanye vs. other 'controversial' artists but like...you see p4k or somebody praising doja cat albums produced by dr luke or even f***ing azealia banks but somehow kanye west saying some stupid trump s*** is beyond the pale lol